9/29 Disney parks crowds and capacity discussion

[rteetz]

In all honesty and with all due respect to the DIS team, I feel that this topic and this discussion on this show was incredibly speculative and uncalled for, this is nothing more than speculation as at no point in time has Disney ever officially disclosed that capacity has been increased in any shape or form, nor has Disney ever released any such information regarding these type of internal decisions. Why is the DIS team spreading misinformation and rumors? A member of the DIS team walking around a park and reporting back on how they "feel" is in no shape or form any type of confirmation that park capacity has been increased or modified in any way.

I strongly encourage the DIS team to be reminded that the DIS Unplugged podcasts have listeners from all over the world, many of which utilize this information to make decisions on their travel plans and in many cases are even customers of Dreams Unlimited Travel. IMHO, spreading misinformation and rumors is not something that the DIS Unplugged podcast should be doing, please stick to factual information.

I think the discussion is healthy and good. I do think putting out numbers is problematic like the 50% increase they discussed. That is where I drew major issue.

The parks certainly have more people today than in July. There is no doubt about that. That is a fair discussion to have.

As a rumormonger I see no issue with discussion rumors when they have merit and a good backing.

 

[teruterubouzu]

I found the conversation really interesting and helpful. People who are considering a vacation deserve to hear about the situation on the ground or at least what people visiting are perceiving it to be. It would be awful to go there thinking you will be walking on every attraction in an empty park only to find yourself in long lines and with social distancing challenges.

 

[TestingH2O]

Whether or not capacity has actually been increased, what concerns me are the reports of Disney not enforcing masks and other safety protocols. The show wasn’t the first time I heard that either. We booked a trip in March because we trusted that Disney was going to set safety regulations and enforce them. It sounds like that isn’t happening as much and, if the trend continues, we will have to re-evaluate our plans.

 

[rteetz]

Whether or not capacity has actually been increased, what concerns me are the reports of Disney not enforcing masks and other safety protocols. The show wasn’t the first time I heard that either. We booked a trip in March because we trusted that Disney was going to set safety regulations and enforce them. It sounds like that isn’t happening as much and, if the trend continues, we will have to re-evaluate our plans.

Disney is still enforcing their rules. Just a week or two ago someone was trespassed for refusing to wear a mask and creating a scene.

 

[plutolovr]

When Disney re-opened in Shanghai, they initially had a self-imposed capacity limit lower than what China told them. They increased to the China number over time, waiting to see how things worked.

I think the same has happened in Florida. They have increased the reservations available, from the initial arbitrary low point which was below what they got permission for. We were there Labor Day weekend when park reservations were maxed out across all 3 types, all 4 parks. We were there this past weekend, where again, all reservations were maxed out across all 3 types, all 4 parks (at least Saturday, Sunday fluctuated). Visibly, there were a LOT more people at Epcot on 9/26 than there were on 9/5. There were generally no lines to get into Mexico on 9/5, there was a long line 9/26 most of the day. Same can be said for just about everywhere else. The only line we had to wait in on 9/5 was Mouse Gears at the end of the day.

Even at 50% capacity, that's a pretty normal sized crowd. In normal times, their AVERAGE daily attendance is roughly 60% of capacity. Even when they shut the gates on peak holidays, they shut them before actual capacity limits.

Just because reservations were not available does not mean they raised capacity. It means that they reached their allotted capacity.

 

[scarslegalcounsel]

Disney is still enforcing their rules. Just a week or two ago someone was trespassed for refusing to wear a mask and creating a scene.

It seems to me that there's a big difference between "refusing to wear a mask and creating a scene" like that fellow that went viral in DHS and the things that Craig and Ryno have described - walking while eating or drinking with the mask out of place, wearing the mask below the nose, taking off masks when in enclosed queues like Rise (and standing right behind Craig while doing it), or moving the mask to sneeze or cough, as well as the general insufficient staffing of the IncrediCrew to enforce the rules consistently.

I'm happy to see and hear their observations as park guests.

 

[rteetz]

It seems to me that there's a big difference between "refusing to wear a mask and creating a scene" like that fellow that went viral in DHS and the things that Craig and Ryno have described - walking while eating or drinking with the mask out of place, wearing the mask below the nose, taking off masks when in enclosed queues like Rise (and standing right behind Craig while doing it), or moving the mask to sneeze or cough, as well as the general insufficient staffing of the IncrediCrew to enforce the rules consistently.

I'm happy to see and hear their observations as park guests.

That is true. I don’t think they’ll ever be able to enforce complete 100% compliance in all areas.

 

[MIDisFan]

That is true. I don’t think they’ll ever be able to enforce complete 100% compliance in all areas.

As crowds increase, compliance is going to be even harder to enforce. We were there from 9/18-24 and noticed a lot of non compliance. Cast members are quick to correct it when they see it but it's impossible to monitor 100%. I never saw non compliance in the queues. World Showcase in Epcot was the worst on our weekend visit, followed by the parking lots and Disney Springs. I have to say, we still never felt unsafe because we were able to maintain safe distance outdoors from the rule breakers. As I look at wait times increase on average each day in the MDE app, it stands to reason that the open areas are getting more crowded as well. That safe feeling I had is starting to fade away for our planned November trip.

 

[OKW Lover]

Whether or not capacity has actually been increased, what concerns me are the reports of Disney not enforcing masks and other safety protocols.

We were at Epcot today (10/1) from 11 am to 1 pm. Saw no problem at all with mask wearing or social distancing. Crowds were very, very light.

 

[MikeTaylor]

We'll be in the parks this month and aren't even messing with weekends:
AK - Mon
HS - Tue
EP - Wed
MK - Thu

 

[MrKnight]

As crowds increase, compliance is going to be even harder to enforce. We were there from 9/18-24 and noticed a lot of non compliance. Cast members are quick to correct it when they see it but it's impossible to monitor 100%. I never saw non compliance in the queues. World Showcase in Epcot was the worst on our weekend visit, followed by the parking lots and Disney Springs. I have to say, we still never felt unsafe because we were able to maintain safe distance outdoors from the rule breakers. As I look at wait times increase on average each day in the MDE app, it stands to reason that the open areas are getting more crowded as well. That safe feeling I had is starting to fade away for our planned November trip.

There is HUGE a difference between non-compliance indoors versus outdoors (scientifically and medically the risk of transmission outdoors is extremely LOW compared to indoors, this has been discussed time and time again by CDC, health officials, doctors, etc.).. With this said, I see no need to overreact if one person or a small group of people is not wearing a mask outdoors or perhaps maybe temporarily removing their mask to eat, drink, get some fresh air, etc. outdoors... No need to overreact outdoors.. Now indoors, that is a different story, I do agree that everyone should be wearing masks indoors at all times unless you are seated at a table inside a restaurant eating/drinking/etc.

 

[MIDisFan]

There is HUGE a difference between non-compliance indoors versus outdoors (scientifically and medically the risk of transmission outdoors is extremely LOW compared to indoors, this has been discussed time and time again by CDC, health officials, doctors, etc.).. With this said, I see no need to overreact if one person or a small group of people is not wearing a mask outdoors or perhaps maybe temporarily removing their mask to eat, drink, get some fresh air, etc. outdoors... No need to overreact outdoors.. Now indoors, that is a different story, I do agree that everyone should be wearing masks indoors at all times unless you are seated at a table inside a restaurant eating/drinking/etc.

We had an outbreak in Michigan over the 4th of July weekend due to a large beach party. While the risk of transmission is low outdoors, I would imagine the reason is due to the ability to distance easier. I agree that a small amount of non compliance is not a cause for concern. My concern is if crowds get to a point where the walkways become impossible to social distance and non compliance increases. On our visit to Epcot on Sunday 9/20, World Showcase felt like a typical summer crowd to us. It seemed as though the entire capacity was concentrated to that area. The area between Nemo and Figment was completely opposite. Might have saw 5 groups of people while we were in that area. Again, we still felt safe because it was outdoors and compliance, while not 100%, was still very high.

With increased crowds and cast member cutbacks, the reality is that social distancing and mask compliance will most likely decline. I think that is something to seriously consider when planning a trip and not just an over reaction.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

As crowds increase, compliance is going to be even harder to enforce. We were there from 9/18-24 and noticed a lot of non compliance. Cast members are quick to correct it when they see it but it's impossible to monitor 100%. I never saw non compliance in the queues. World Showcase in Epcot was the worst on our weekend visit, followed by the parking lots and Disney Springs. I have to say, we still never felt unsafe because we were able to maintain safe distance outdoors from the rule breakers. As I look at wait times increase on average each day in the MDE app, it stands to reason that the open areas are getting more crowded as well. That safe feeling I had is starting to fade away for our planned November trip.

I think it will never be 100% compliance - and if anyone goes expecting that or requiring that to feel safe then you might want to reconsider. But I do think the parks are doing well compared to a lot of places. As one data point, Len Testa from Touring Plans said he was in MK last Sunday counting people and he counted 1,000 people and only 1% weren't wearing a mask properly. Statistically that is really good - but it isn't 100%

I think the concern with seeing reports of increased crowds is that it increases the chance of being in a situation where you can't distance yourself from someone (of the few, statistically) that aren't complying.

I don't know if the parks are up to the "danger" level yet - vast majority of reports I have seen said it still seems ok, but getting to that point that they are at about as many people as they can fit given current offerings (e.g., not many shows open to absorb crowds, etc).

If I had a trip coming up I would be watching really closely to see how things going - I think currently they are ok (especially if you can avoid weekends) but getting close to that point I would be concerned

 

[rteetz]

1% weren't eating a mask properly.

Are edible masks the big new thing?

 

[TheMaxRebo]

Are edible masks the big new thing?

It's all part of the 2020 food and wine festival experience. You can choose your mask sampling pack in either sweet or savory flavors

 

[Tiggerette]

It's all part of the 2020 food and wine festival experience. You can choose your mask sampling pack in either sweet or savory flavors

Yes.... It's a really thick Spring Roll Wrap. You have the choice of Basil or Carrot inlay to give you a little extra plant-based fibers to your delectable mask!
(I kid! I kid!)

Also.... I agree there is a difference between attendance and capacity. However, that distinction doesn't obviate the possibility that the capacity was also increased to allow for higher attendance if guests availed themselves of an open reservation.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

Yes.... It's a really thick Spring Roll Wrap. You have the choice of Basil or Carrot inlay to give you a little extra plant-based fibers to your delectable mask!
(I kid! I kid!)

Also.... I agree there is a difference between attendance and capacity. However, that distinction doesn't obviate the possibility that the capacity was also increased to allow for higher attendance if guests availed themselves of an open reservation.

of for sure - no way anyone can really prove it either way

and, it really doesn't matter if they haveincreased capacity or not ... the fact is there are more people there now than there were in July/August and people need to decide if they are still comfortable visiting with these levels of crowds

 

[rteetz]

https://www.wdwmagic.com/attraction...longer-waits-and-less-physical-distancing.htm
Note another source indicates that capacity increased by 10%. I can believe that. 50 seems high yet.

 

[YesterDark]

I think it will never be 100% compliance - and if anyone goes expecting that or requiring that to feel safe then you might want to reconsider. But I do think the parks are doing well compared to a lot of places. As one data point, Len Testa from Touring Plans said he was in MK last Sunday counting people and he counted 1,000 people and only 1% weren't wearing a mask properly. Statistically that is really good - but it isn't 100%

I think the concern with seeing reports of increased crowds is that it increases the chance of being in a situation where you can't distance yourself from someone (of the few, statistically) that aren't complying.

I don't know if the parks are up to the "danger" level yet - vast majority of reports I have seen said it still seems ok, but getting to that point that they are at about as many people as they can fit given current offerings (e.g., not many shows open to absorb crowds, etc).

If I had a trip coming up I would be watching really closely to see how things going - I think currently they are ok (especially if you can avoid weekends) but getting close to that point I would be concerned

Oh where did you hear that from Len Testa?

As you reach capacity in a park, even the lower capacity, there is over flow in queues and things look "more crowded". There is also a confirmation bias with people like Craig who have been going to the parks when crowds were extremely low. They are LOOKING for crowds to get higher so they can report that "crowds are high" because it'll be something to talk about. They're probably doing this subconsciously.

 

[Good Disney Fairy]

I noticed this too, when I booked we could not get Studios reservations, they were all gone. I called to add an additional day to our reservation and asked if a park every opens up after the reservations were all claimed, the cast member said, she had never seen that happen. Two days latter magically the studios was green, I snatched up a day for my husband and I.