Just stop going

[whiporee]

I just read a post on another thread where someone was complaining about WDW again. I didn't want to confront them directly, because it's not really about them. It's about an overall mindset of some of our posters here.

I mean this with pure kindness. If you feel that WDw is a waste of money, you and your family should avoid WDW from now on. I could argue all your points and tell you the accusations you're making are actually not backed up by a single solitary fact, but it wouldn't make a difference to you. So don't go -- remove the place from your life. If you feel WDW isn't a value for you, then there's no way you'd have a good time there, and the negativity you feel towards the place will undoubtably leak into other guests as your frustrations seethe out of you. I know it will affect posters here whoa re sincerely either offering advice or asking questions about an upcoming trip.

So just stop. Stop telling other people who consider the place great how wrong they are, how it used to be so much better (for the record, it wasn't. I grew up in Orlando, have been going for 45 some odd years. It's the same as it ever was). Stop complaining about long waits while you're waiting in lines. Stop arguing with the people who think it's a good value and telling them it's not. I mean, why tell someone else how they shouldn't spend their money, or have them second guess an expensive choice they made. Its one thing to offer a review or an opinion -- it's quite another to falsely rant for no purpose other than to say the place sucks.

it doesn't. Best theme park in the world. For the most part, most complaints are matters of degrees.

I think the large majority of people who come to this site do so because they actually either love Disney, or they want to learn about Disney because they are headed there soon and are excited. That's the large majority of visitors here. But there are some -- more than a few -- who hate the place, and sort of hate the people who love it. They spend a LOT of pixels telling people how this sucks, and how that sucks and how much better it used to be before whatever new was implemented. And it serves no purpose beyond making people scared. And making them second guess their choices and go into a well-funded and anticipated vacation looking for problems. Expecting issues that may or may not arise.

So you don't think the place is worth the time, money or effort. Stop going. Stop talking about it. Move on.

 

[vacationer1954]

It is sometimes mystifying how much energy some people invest in something that they claim is not, or no longer, giving them what they want/expect/enjoy. I think, with Disney, it is more often than not driven by money concerns, but I see it elsewhere with regard to anything that either deliberately cultivated a following based on an image they presented or had such a following evolve naturally. Most of us learn quickly that "everything changes, and ends" and so we learn to keep everything in perspective, not investing so much in anything that doesn't come with it a, "'til death do us part," promise. Some either never learn that lesson or turn it off in favor of latching onto something pleasing that they "never want it to stop," (or change). The consequence of that is as you described, a conversion of much of the energy that used to be directed toward reveling in what was pleasing into energy directed toward stewing on how things have changed, ruminating about "the good ol' days", and otherwise spreading a sense of disappointment (because misery loves company) and sometimes even fatalism.

 

[PSUGuy]

While I agree with the sentiment I beg to differ on the 'It's the same as it ever was' bit. Adventurer's Club, Comedy Warehouse, Off Kilter, WS Players, free WDW resort parking etc. 'Nuf said.

Bill From PA

 

[rileyz]

I’ve been going for over 30 years and it’s not the same. Some things are better, some are worse.

 

[DisneyOma]

I just read a post on another thread where someone was complaining about WDW again. I didn't want to confront them directly, because it's not really about them. It's about an overall mindset of some of our posters here.

I mean this with pure kindness. If you feel that WDw is a waste of money, you and your family should avoid WDW from now on. I could argue all your points and tell you the accusations you're making are actually not backed up by a single solitary fact, but it wouldn't make a difference to you. So don't go -- remove the place from your life. If you feel WDW isn't a value for you, then there's no way you'd have a good time there, and the negativity you feel towards the place will undoubtably leak into other guests as your frustrations seethe out of you. I know it will affect posters here whoa re sincerely either offering advice or asking questions about an upcoming trip.

So just stop. Stop telling other people who consider the place great how wrong they are, how it used to be so much better (for the record, it wasn't. I grew up in Orlando, have been going for 45 some odd years. It's the same as it ever was). Stop complaining about long waits while you're waiting in lines. Stop arguing with the people who think it's a good value and telling them it's not. I mean, why tell someone else how they shouldn't spend their money, or have them second guess an expensive choice they made. Its one thing to offer a review or an opinion -- it's quite another to falsely rant for no purpose other than to say the place sucks.

it doesn't. Best theme park in the world. For the most part, most complaints are matters of degrees.

I think the large majority of people who come to this site do so because they actually either love Disney, or they want to learn about Disney because they are headed there soon and are excited. That's the large majority of visitors here. But there are some -- more than a few -- who hate the place, and sort of hate the people who love it. They spend a LOT of pixels telling people how this sucks, and how that sucks and how much better it used to be before whatever new was implemented. And it serves no purpose beyond making people scared. And making them second guess their choices and go into a well-funded and anticipated vacation looking for problems. Expecting issues that may or may not arise.

So you don't think the place is worth the time, money or effort. Stop going. Stop talking about it. Move on.

While I get your reason for making this post, you're actually doing exactly the same thing you are telling people not to do, LOL!

 

[kathy884]

Just a guess, but perhaps the people doing all the posting are going through a grieving process. They haven't moved on yet, and they really would love to go back to something that isn't the same anymore. The boards are probably their way of dealing with that, and they are looking for others who used to love Disney/Orlando too that are feeling the same way they are. Posting here and hearing from other people who feel similarly helps them feel less alone. Where else can they find people who love Disney or used to love Disney who would understand?

I really and truly think Disney and previous Disney experiences are so special for so many people that for some who don't have the love now, it's not that easy to just go to Trip Advisor and plan the trip to Costa Rica instead.

I think after going through this grieving many of these poster are excellent candidates to enjoy Disney again and see good things in it, even though it will never be the same and they will always to a certain extent miss some things that used to be. Others will find new favorite destinations and experiences that they enjoy, again good, but not the same.

I think forums like this serve an important purpose in this regard. And it spares friends and family members from hearing this over and over. And most people will and do move on, but sometimes it can take as long as a year. And I would not be surprised if people are looking these boards periodically and posting during that time.

 

[GPC0321]

I get frustrated with the Negative Nellies too. I have found in my life that the people who complain the most often have certain personality traits that make them prone to finding reasons to complain. They're the same people that aren't fun to go out to eat with because you know they are going to complain, send things back, and basically make what should have been a nice evening into a cringe-worthy experience.

I think in the case of Disney, there is that old adage, "You can never go home again." Most people who are (or were) fans of the place have a strong positive memory of a visit there. We want to return and recreate that same level of joy, and it's nearly impossible for that to happen. Whether it's a restaurant or a resort or even an attraction, there are too many variables at play in a place like WDW for us to be guaranteed the same level of enjoyment that we got on a previous visit.

For example, the first time I stayed on property was 20 years ago at CSR. My memory of that trip is nothing but pure joy and amazement. Went back to CSR 17 years later and...meh. I don't think that is CSR's fault at all. I think my memory of CSR and that trip long ago could never be equaled. It was my first on-property stay. First time at Downtown Disney. First time at Animal Kingdom and Hollywood Studios.

I knew I wanted to go back after that trip, but I knew I didn't want to go at the same time of year and stay at the same place. So we planned Christmastime at the Grand Floridian (renting DVC). We focused the trip on Christmasy experiences and wow! It was amazing! Now VGF has won my heart and we do plan to return there next year, but during summer instead of December.

My upcoming trip is going to be unlike any I've taken or will be taking because it's just me and my BFF (of 30 years). We've never gone to Disney together, we've never stayed (or even been to) Animal Kingdom Lodge/Kidani Village, we've never eaten at any of the restaurants where we have ADRs, and we've never ridden some of the attractions we are going to ride. So, I expect this to be a fresh new way to experience Disney.

I'm not saying Disney is infallible, and a lot of it comes down to personal preference and having realistic expectations. I know from experience that doing the same thing with the same expectation over and over again can take the shine off of the experience. And once that happens, the flaws start becoming more obvious.

 

[paisleys]

I live in FL too and grew up going since 1972. It has definitely changed, especially in the last decade. We could go to Magic Kingdom in 2001, 2002 and ride a dozen rides in a day with no fast passes. I can recall a trip in 2007 where we only got on one ride and only because someone else had had enough of the crowds and gave us their fast passes. The crowds have really ramped up. I think WDW is doing a great job of crowd management though. I love having three guaranteed fast passes and not having to run to a ride to get a fast pass the minute we got there. Also 15 years ago you could easily walk into restaurants like Le Cellier for lunch without a priority seating. I think the free meal plans kind of killed smaller restaurants like that, though things have gotten better since they've doubled the meal credit cost also the ADR penalty fee keeps people from glomming up 5 different restaurant reservations in the same time period. I still love Disney though, even the smell of Magic Kingdom when you first walk in but we are taking a break. It's a vert special place to me and I will definitely go back. However, the crowds scare me. It's always been crowded but now everything feels like a fight. However, that's how I feel about concerts and anywhere with crowds. Some people don't mind.

 

[mom2rtk]

A post complaining about complaining?

 

[epcotobsessed]

However, the crowds scare me. It's always been crowded but now everything feels like a fight. However, that's how I feel about concerts and anywhere with crowds. Some people don't mind.

This is true for me. I have only been going regularly (2-3 times a year) for about 10 years and I do feel like the crowds have gotten worse. I also agree that it's something you either accept or don't accept - complaining about crowds does not change anything. One of the many reasons I love Epcot is that it holds crowds well, certainly much better than MK or AK which are both parks that I need to leave by 11am or 12pm because I feel like I can barely move in them. Doing this works for me, and if it doesn't work for others, or if others aren't bothered by it, that's cool.

 

[Ariel Wanna-be]

Just a guess, but perhaps the people doing all the posting are going through a grieving process. They haven't moved on yet, and they really would love to go back to something that isn't the same anymore. The boards are probably their way of dealing with that, and they are looking for others who used to love Disney/Orlando too that are feeling the same way they are. Posting here and hearing from other people who feel similarly helps them feel less alone. Where else can they find people who love Disney or used to love Disney who would understand?

I really and truly think Disney and previous Disney experiences are so special for so many people that for some who don't have the love now, it's not that easy to just go to Trip Advisor and plan the trip to Costa Rica instead.

I think after going through this grieving many of these poster are excellent candidates to enjoy Disney again and see good things in it, even though it will never be the same and they will always to a certain extent miss some things that used to be. Others will find new favorite destinations and experiences that they enjoy, again good, but not the same.

I think forums like this serve an important purpose in this regard. And it spares friends and family members from hearing this over and over. And most people will and do move on, but sometimes it can take as long as a year. And I would not be surprised if people are looking these boards periodically and posting during that time.

Well said!

 

[goofyernmost]

It also is a thing where people base their opinion on their own emotions. When they first went there the excitement for them was palpable. Many were very young at the time and were completely taken in by the lights, the fun and the massive diversion from real life. They carry that through into adult life when our expectations and perceptions change. As a child we really never did focus on details, we focused on the big picture (something that theme parks count on). As we age we go back expecting the same emotional reaction that we had the first time. However, life doesn't work that way. Things could be identical, but, in our advancing maturity we see it differently. It no longer incites that excitement, that feeling of euphoria that can only exist the first time we see something. We therefore judge it as not being as good as it was and, heaven forbid, if something that we found important in our past, is missing then all our memories of it are all glowing and shiny and no flaws are allowed to interfere with our memories.

I often use the comparison of how we perceive the home we grew up in. Remember how big the place was? Go back as an adult and the reality is how did we even have room to turn around in that little place. What we remember as a child is usually very distorted.

So anyway, living up to the philosophy that misery loves company, they paint a picture of despair to express there way of blaming the lack of "magic" on the location and not on the fact that their very being now interprets "magic" differently. To paraphrase, the change is not in the stars, it is in ourselves.

 

[dreiwhit]

OP, after our experiences on our last trip with very crowded parks in the "off season", foreign tour groups, having to deal with people trying to shove us out of the way to get on trams, long FP and stand by waits, increased prices, broken down rides, grumpy CMs, long waits in shops (lines snaking out the doors) and 35 minute waits for guest relations (ever seen a queue rope put up outside of guest relations?), we've had enough. If I never go back to a Disney park, my heart won't be broken.

We've made three recent trips in the last almost three years. And during that time, I can see how things have changed, not for the better.

My 10 year old daughter told me at Epcot "Disney used to be magical. Now its an overcrowded amusement park." When a 10 year old Disney loving little girl says that, there is a problem.

 

[GillianP1301]

When I first started posing here, I was struck by the extremes - both postiive and negative and figured out pretty quickly that the truth lies somewhere in the middle and to be honest, even though I do enjoy reading others peoples opinions and experiences, I put very little stock in them and they have very little to no impact on my decision making. But, for those who are here researching, it can be pretty misleading to read multiple threads of why a dining plan sucks and eating granola bars for breakfast in your room is better or how every line is 5 hours long (extreme examples).

As for the truly negative or disheartened, I completely agree with the sentiment. If you are no longer feeling you are getting value for your vacation dollar, then move on. But, don't expect the rest of the world to move on with you because everyone's expectations and experiences are different.

 

[GillianP1301]

OP, after our experiences on our last trip with very crowded parks in the "off season", foreign tour groups, having to deal with people trying to shove us out of the way to get on trams, long FP and stand by waits, increased prices, broken down rides, grumpy CMs, long waits in shops (lines snaking out the doors) and 35 minute waits for guest relations (ever seen a queue rope put up outside of guest relations?), we've had enough. If I never go back to a Disney park, my heart won't be broken.

We've made three recent trips in the last almost three years. And during that time, I can see how things have changed, not for the better.

My 10 year old daughter told me at Epcot "Disney used to be magical. Now its an overcrowded amusement park." When a 10 year old Disney loving little girl says that, there is a problem.

A child at that age will almost always parrot their parents. Even if the parent isn't saying those specific words, they will most certainly feed off of negative energy. It happens in day to day life with kids, not just Disney.

Sorry Disney has lost it's magic for you, I hope you find a better fit for you in future vacation destinations.

 

[HopperFan]

I just read a post on another thread where someone was complaining about WDW again. I didn't want to confront them directly, because it's not really about them. It's about an overall mindset of some of our posters here.

I mean this with pure kindness. If you feel that WDw is a waste of money, you and your family should avoid WDW from now on. I could argue all your points and tell you the accusations you're making are actually not backed up by a single solitary fact, but it wouldn't make a difference to you. So don't go -- remove the place from your life. If you feel WDW isn't a value for you, then there's no way you'd have a good time there, and the negativity you feel towards the place will undoubtably leak into other guests as your frustrations seethe out of you. I know it will affect posters here whoa re sincerely either offering advice or asking questions about an upcoming trip.

So just stop. Stop telling other people who consider the place great how wrong they are, how it used to be so much better (for the record, it wasn't. I grew up in Orlando, have been going for 45 some odd years. It's the same as it ever was). Stop complaining about long waits while you're waiting in lines. Stop arguing with the people who think it's a good value and telling them it's not. I mean, why tell someone else how they shouldn't spend their money, or have them second guess an expensive choice they made. Its one thing to offer a review or an opinion -- it's quite another to falsely rant for no purpose other than to say the place sucks.

it doesn't. Best theme park in the world. For the most part, most complaints are matters of degrees.

I think the large majority of people who come to this site do so because they actually either love Disney, or they want to learn about Disney because they are headed there soon and are excited. That's the large majority of visitors here. But there are some -- more than a few -- who hate the place, and sort of hate the people who love it. They spend a LOT of pixels telling people how this sucks, and how that sucks and how much better it used to be before whatever new was implemented. And it serves no purpose beyond making people scared. And making them second guess their choices and go into a well-funded and anticipated vacation looking for problems. Expecting issues that may or may not arise.

So you don't think the place is worth the time, money or effort. Stop going. Stop talking about it. Move on.

If the thread is to complain about folks on another thread then starting a new thread is really no different than the complainers on the other thread. This post would have more power and engage more both side conversation if posted there. I don't get not wanting to "confront" them when creating a whole new thread to complain about them is worse.

That said ... I've been going to WDW since 1970, yup my family was one who visited the Preview Center before it opened. Next trip one month after it opened. Going ever since. WDW has ABSOLUTELY CHANGED over the years in every single way. Some for the good, some for the worse. It is still one of the most creative and beautiful places in the theme park world but in the last 8-10 years has moved towards a more standardized amusement park in many ways. Many of us won't stop going but we absolutely will have adjust our expectations and experience.

I get not liking people telling others what to think, this post is the same exact thing just the other side. So somewhere in the middle between this thread pretense and the other thread - is most of the rest of us. Trips planned and based in the reality of Disney World TODAY, which is not the same as trips planned and based in reality of what it once was 5 years ago, 10 years ago, 20 years ago or 40 years ago.

I do always say that vacation is priceless and a luxury many spend $$$ on. If you aren't happy with your destination, if you question whether you want to go ... then it the time to take a break and go somewhere else. It is NOT for everyone, it's NOT somewhere everyone has to go and NO ONE's trip or experience is the same. And that is all okay. So ............. let it go.

 

[ArwenMarie]

Just don't read threads that annoy you?

 

[DisArmyWife215]

I just read a post on another thread where someone was complaining about WDW again. I didn't want to confront them directly, because it's not really about them. It's about an overall mindset of some of our posters here.

I mean this with pure kindness. If you feel that WDw is a waste of money, you and your family should avoid WDW from now on. I could argue all your points and tell you the accusations you're making are actually not backed up by a single solitary fact, but it wouldn't make a difference to you. So don't go -- remove the place from your life. If you feel WDW isn't a value for you, then there's no way you'd have a good time there, and the negativity you feel towards the place will undoubtably leak into other guests as your frustrations seethe out of you. I know it will affect posters here whoa re sincerely either offering advice or asking questions about an upcoming trip.

So just stop. Stop telling other people who consider the place great how wrong they are, how it used to be so much better (for the record, it wasn't. I grew up in Orlando, have been going for 45 some odd years. It's the same as it ever was). Stop complaining about long waits while you're waiting in lines. Stop arguing with the people who think it's a good value and telling them it's not. I mean, why tell someone else how they shouldn't spend their money, or have them second guess an expensive choice they made. Its one thing to offer a review or an opinion -- it's quite another to falsely rant for no purpose other than to say the place sucks.

it doesn't. Best theme park in the world. For the most part, most complaints are matters of degrees.

I think the large majority of people who come to this site do so because they actually either love Disney, or they want to learn about Disney because they are headed there soon and are excited. That's the large majority of visitors here. But there are some -- more than a few -- who hate the place, and sort of hate the people who love it. They spend a LOT of pixels telling people how this sucks, and how that sucks and how much better it used to be before whatever new was implemented. And it serves no purpose beyond making people scared. And making them second guess their choices and go into a well-funded and anticipated vacation looking for problems. Expecting issues that may or may not arise.

So you don't think the place is worth the time, money or effort. Stop going. Stop talking about it. Move on.

Totally agree. We went to a local theme park a few weekends back the place shows it's age, has chipped paint and there was trash all over. Far and few employees who you could tell hated their jobs and were miserable in the heat. And while standing in a long line looking at a wooden corral I thought I could be at Disney with immersive and interactive queues, cast members who smile and make it enjoyable in FL heat and actually be enjoying my day. I've learned who to share my Disney planning madness and fun vacation stories with and who not to. At the end of the day to each their own, just don't bash my decisions cause it's not your cup of tea.

 

[whiporee]

My 10 year old daughter told me at Epcot "Disney used to be magical. Now its an overcrowded amusement park." When a 10 year old Disney loving little girl says that, there is a problem.

What magical time was she comparing it to? She's not old enough to remember WDW in any incarnation other than the present one.

Your post is kind of my point. I respect and admire your decision to not spend any more time or money there. But why are you trying to ruin other people's perception? Every point you made could be counteracted by a dozen testimonies about kind CMs and helpful guest services. I've never seen a line at a shop snake out a door, but even if I had it's not like a common occurrence. You're much more likely to walk up to the counter. On any given the day the vast majority of rides are in full operation. Yet you're projecting onto the place like it's Action Point.

 

[whiporee]

While I agree with the sentiment I beg to differ on the 'It's the same as it ever was' bit. Adventurer's Club, Comedy Warehouse, Off Kilter, WS Players, free WDW resort parking etc. 'Nuf said.

Magical Express, FPs (the ability to reserve a ride is a pretty good perk), online ordering, Photo Pass (even if you don't buy the pics, they'll still use your camera to take a picture for you), a few new rides and restaurants. Not to mention new parks, the ability to go between them with a fairly minimal cost, bus transportation to anywhere you want to go. Some things have been lost and some things have been added, but it doesn't take away form the overall experience.

The point isn't that everything is the same, because obviously it's not. But this sentiment that it used to be so much better -- that the overall experience used to be so much higher -- simply isn't true. There may be individual experiences that are missed, but they've been replaced. You might not like the new ones as much, but I think it's inaccurate to say there's a void in their place. It's always been crowded, it's always been hot. It's always been expensive and there have always been lines -- that is the nature of theme parks.

Crowds do, I admit. But aside from jacking the prices, there's not a lot Disney could or should do about them.