Star Wars: The Last Jedi - Reaction and Discussion *CONTAINS SPOILERS*

[TheMaxRebo]

Add in how good Rogue One was

Although that one seems to be divisive as well ... I have seen some people rate that as their least favorite of all the Star Wars movies. I seem to like it more than most (to me it is my 2nd favorite, behind Empire)

 

[Disneymom1126]

The other thing is that, and I don't want to speak for all of them, but I am sure a lot of the critics didn't spend the past two years over analyzing everything from TFA and coming up with theories for who Rey's parents are and who Snoke is (is he Anakin? Plaegus?, etc) so they weren't disappointed that the answers didn't match what they came up in their heads

I agree with this. I also think anyone going into this looking for those positive moments that restore your hope are going to be disappointed - there was a lot of bad news for the rebels in this movie - by the end their fleet is destroyed, most of them are destroyed, Luke is gone (at least physically), etc. I think people went in with a set of expectations on how the movie would go and since it didn't go that way, they don't know how to take it. I personally think the choices make sense and am excited to see how the handful of rebels left are going to regain their strength and fight the first order in 9.

 

[LSLS]

Although that one seems to be divisive as well ... I have seen some people rate that as their least favorite of all the Star Wars movies. I seem to like it more than most (to me it is my 2nd favorite, behind Empire)

Rogue One had like an 87% among movie goers I thought. I thought it was great.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

Rogue One had like an 87% among movie goers I thought. I thought it was great.

i agree - but seems to be a love/hate thing with it ... see it either at the very top of people's rankings or towards the bottom - not a lot of middle ground

 

[adam.adbe]

i agree - but seems to be a love/hate thing with it ... see it either at the very top of people's rankings or towards the bottom - not a lot of middle ground

The problem with Rogue One (which I thought was a really good movie) is that like EP3 (which was *not* a really good movie), it's just so damn bleak. There's not a lot of incentive for repeat viewing unless you're into that kind of thing.

I'm sure that plays into a lot of the more negative responses.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

The problem with Rogue One (which I thought was a really good movie) is that like EP3 (which was *not* a really good movie), it's just so damn bleak. There's not a lot of incentive for repeat viewing unless you're into that kind of thing.

I'm sure that plays into a lot of the more negative responses.

Fair point - though I definitely have re-watched episode 3 way more than episodes 1 and 2

I just like a lot of the other things brought up in Rogue One - like the Guardians of the Whills - which I thought expanded the universe (at least, within cannon). Plus I loved K-2SO

Maybe I am ok with bleakness - I mean, to be honest, other than bad a** Luke Skywalker I am not really a fan of Return of the Jedi but love Empire

 

[tjkraz]

I think history will judge episode 8 based upon whatever happens in episode 9. If most of these moves have a satisfying payoff, we'll be able to look back on the entire trilogy fondly.

I'm willing to give the storytellers that latitude. Though I'm not entirely sure what to make of Snoke and Phasma. For 3 years now we've seemingly heard how they were both "important" to the story, yet they met their fates as very one-dimensional figures.

One random thought on the ending and the force powers demonstrated by the boy. Luke had a lot to say about balance between the light and dark sides of the force. I wonder if Luke didn't somehow realize that he had personally amassed so much of the light side that it was retarding the growth of others. Perhaps his passing was a necessary move to pave the way for a new generation of Jedi.

 

[skier_pete]

I really enjoyed it. Reading where people are complaining about it - I get where they are coming from, that it didn't really tell the story they were hoping it told. For those that grew up with Luke Skywalker as a hero of the trilogy, to see him sort of weighed down by his decisions - it was hard to take. But I thought overall the story was wonderful, Finn, Rey and Poe all had great moments of growth as characters, and I kind of loved the ending. The biggest problem with "The Force Awakens" is how beholden it seemed to fitting into the OT mold. This movie did not at all. (It was rather small in scope as well.)

The other interesting thing I found is that TFA left me asking questions and ended on a cliffhanger. This movie ripped most of the questions away and didn't cliff-hang at all - but more than ANYTHING it left me wanting to see where they go from here - feeling like I have NO IDEA what's going to happen next - and I think that's a pretty good feeling. (Only to be tempered by knowing JJ Abrams is the guy taking me there.)

For those saying "it was worse than the prequels" - have you SEEN those lately? They were bad to begin with but have aged worse. My daughter was into TPM and AotC for a short time and watched them repeatedly. AotC is an awful, awful movie. TPM fares slightly better in comparison except for the fact it is almost completely unnecessary. I don't want to turn this into a "slog on the prequels" thread, but there's no way 10 years from now anyone will think this movie is worse than the terrible prequels.

 

[adam.adbe]

One random thought on the ending and the force powers demonstrated by the boy. Luke had a lot to say about balance between the light and dark sides of the force. I wonder if Luke didn't somehow realize that he had personally amassed so much of the light side that it was retarding the growth of others. Perhaps his passing was a necessary move to pave the way for a new generation of Jedi.

That's a clever thought. If so though, the death of Snoke would have unpleasant reverse consequences.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

I think history will judge episode 8 based upon whatever happens in episode 9. If most of these moves have a satisfying payoff, we'll be able to look back on the entire trilogy fondly.

I fully agree that Episode 9 will be the key to how this entire trilogy is viewed and there is a lot of pressure on it to make the decisions made for Episode 8 have a proper pay off ....

(Only to be tempered by knowing JJ Abrams is the guy taking me there.)

.... and that does make me a bit worried as I find, in general, JJ is a better idea / lead-off person than closer

 

[TheMaxRebo]

Though I'm not entirely sure what to make of Snoke and Phasma. For 3 years now we've seemingly heard how they were both "important" to the story, yet they met their fates as very one-dimensional figures.

My understanding is that Rian Johnson indicated Snoke will be in episode 9 (not sure if that is as a flashback or what but I don't think we have heard the last from him)

As for Phasma - she does have her own book and played a role in Finn's backstory as well (Finn was part of her regiment and basically abused him and pushed him to be better) but as far as actual screen time, I think she is going to be the Boba Fett of this trilogy - a cool character that didn't really do all that much on screen

 

[umichigan10]

Yeah, except then he tries to kill her later, which really confused me. Then I read that quote about her using the force, and I became equally confused for completely different reasons. It still confuses me about why he didn't shoot her on the ship, but I guess something along the lines of he was confused what he wanted and who he was (and if he wanted to go against his mother), then figured it out and that would be the Supreme Leader? I don't know.

I just think kylos character is really angry/confused. I don’t think he’s evil per se, but conflicted, and I think this movie added more depth to him instead of the emo hot topic vibe from TFA.

 

[skier_pete]

I just think kylos character is really angry/confused. I don’t think he’s evil per se, but conflicted, and I think this movie added more depth to him instead of the emo hot topic vibe from TFA.

I am still not sure he pulls it off (the character not the actor) as a true lead villian. He still seems more petulant boy with daddy issues than grand schemer.

 

[umichigan10]

I am still not sure he pulls it off (the character not the actor) as a true lead villian. He still seems more petulant boy with daddy issues than grand schemer.

Yeah I think he’s honestly gonna end up back in the light/middle ground. I can’t see Rey killing him. I think they’ll both kinda gravitate toward the middle in 9 and realize that the light and darkness has its goods, and that balance is necessary

 

[AMusicLifeForMe]

Just bought tickets to see my 2nd showing of TLJ today. Hopefully I can think of this film differently going in to see it a 2nd time and not really having a full theater.

As I have thought about things, I have really determined that I liked the film. There were just different aspects throughout that I thought was a waste. Personally, I found myself not liking the first half of the film, but really enjoying the second half. Maybe if this film was 30 minutes longer, then I would probably feel like the first half wasn't as rushed as it seemed to me.

I will let everyone know what I think after my second viewing today.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

I just think kylos character is really angry/confused. I don’t think he’s evil per se, but conflicted, and I think this movie added more depth to him instead of the emo hot topic vibe from TFA.

I definitely liked him/his character better in this movie than in TFA. I think he is still drawn to the Dark Side/ wants the power it can give him and his emotions/hate are fueled by it, etc.

he definitely wants to not be a Sith but be his own person but wants control and power and show that he is "the man" - but you can still see the emotions get him at times (like when he ordered all the guns to fire at Luke) .... though I guess that is the difference between the dark side and light side of the Force - the Dark side uses your emotions/gains strength by them (you saw Anakin/Vader and even Sidious giving in to emotions a lot more - and Palapatine using Anakin's emotions to get him to turn) whereas the light is about suppressing them

 

[TheMaxRebo]

Just bought tickets to see my 2nd showing of TLJ today. Hopefully I can think of this film differently going in to see it a 2nd time and not really having a full theater.

As I have thought about things, I have really determined that I liked the film. There were just different aspects throughout that I thought was a waste. Personally, I found myself not liking the first half of the film, but really enjoying the second half. Maybe if this film was 30 minutes longer, then I would probably feel like the first half wasn't as rushed as it seemed to me.

I will let everyone know what I think after my second viewing today.

That is very much how I felt ... that if the last half was a standalone movie it might be my favorite of all the Star Wars movies, but the first half had some definitely issues and just seemed "off" and I remember thinking to myself at the start "this is ok, but doesn't seem that great compared to the early reactions" - so I definitely want to see it again to see now that I know what is coming, does that change how I view the first half

 

[skier_pete]

Yeah I think he’s honestly gonna end up back in the light/middle ground. I can’t see Rey killing him. I think they’ll both kinda gravitate toward the middle in 9 and realize that the light and darkness has its goods, and that balance is necessary

No - I don't think so - that moment came and went in this movie.

One thing I feel like we haven't seen. It's really mentioned in both these movies, but more explicitly in this one. Ben/Kylo destroyed the Jedi training academy, and he took several students with him. It's implied he formed the "Knights of Ren" with them - they would've been a bunch of force users. Where are these characters? I wonder if we are going to see Rey bringing together a bunch of force users and Kylo as well and then an all out battle of sorts.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

Yeah I think he’s honestly gonna end up back in the light/middle ground. I can’t see Rey killing him. I think they’ll both kinda gravitate toward the middle in 9 and realize that the light and darkness has its goods, and that balance is necessary

will be interesting to see how they go. Definitely seems that there is a underlying current to the series that "power corrupts, and absolute power corrupts absolutely" - be it the Sith or the Jedi council ... so I could also see Rey learning this and sort of "giving up" some power or not being corrupted by it, while Kylo goes all in and in the end it consumes him and is his own undoing

 

[TheMaxRebo]

No - I don't think so - that moment came and went in this movie.

One thing I feel like we haven't seen. It's really mentioned in both these movies, but more explicitly in this one. Ben/Kylo destroyed the Jedi training academy, and he took several students with him. It's implied he formed the "Knights of Ren" with them - they would've been a bunch of force users. Where are these characters? I wonder if we are going to see Rey bringing together a bunch of force users and Kylo as well and then an all out battle of sorts.

Good point and I did see that mentioned ealy: where are the rest of the Knights of Ren? Other than in the flashback scene we really haven't seen them. Maybe Kylo had been keeping them in hiding given the whole Sith "rule of two" but now that he has ended/denounced the Sith, perhaps they can come back

Would be cool to see an all out fight between multiple force users - really only got that in the prequels