Fast Pass

[tstottle]

I'm grateful for the discussion here. My family is considering a trip to WDW in early July. We haven't been in several years and are missing it. But, as fans of the big attractions and former FP pros, we really like to minimize line time and maximize big attraction time. We haven't been since the FP Tiers were introduced. It sounds like we should wait longer like maybe next summer, or until the kids can go on a college fall break, instead of being tied to the high school schedule. I think just the uncertainty is enough for me to write off WDW for this summer...not knowing if/when they will reestablish FPs and if there will be a cost and the race to book them if/when that happens. And not knowing what lines will be like; it sounds like they will be bad. I think any travel destinations this summer will be crowded as everyone tries to make up for lost time!

 

[Pyxie]

There's a lot of debate in this thread about FP+ or no FP+, but I think you're debating the wrong thing. I think it's highly unlikely that FP doesn't come back at all. It's way more likely that it'll either come back as it was or it will be some new paid program. The question should be "would you pay for it?" (Personally, I would depending on price, etc.)

 

[LSUfan4444]

There's a lot of debate in this thread about FP+ or no FP+, but I think you're debating the wrong thing

I think thats the current debate because thats the current reality. For some, the existence of FP is a deciding factor in their vacation and in my opinion, it shouldn't be. I think the value placed in them is EXTREMELY over valued since nobody has access to them right now. But, you do bring up a good point...anyone who is delaying a trip until FP comes back should definitely expect to pay for it in some sort of way (whether is be a resort upgrade or a different up-charge or package, etc).

 

[GoingSince1990]

I think thats the current debate because thats the current reality. For some, the existence of FP is a deciding factor in their vacation and in my opinion, it shouldn't be. I think the value placed in them is EXTREMELY over valued since nobody has access to them right now. But, you do bring up a good point...anyone who is delaying a trip until FP comes back should definitely expect to pay for it in some sort of way (whether is be a resort upgrade or a different up-charge or package, etc).

I think that at some point Disney will simply announce “Fastpass is back!” and it will return in the same form as before Covid. I also expect to see the reintroduction of paid EMM and DAH events.

 

[disneypharm]

I think thats the current debate because thats the current reality. For some, the existence of FP is a deciding factor in their vacation and in my opinion, it shouldn't be. I think the value placed in them is EXTREMELY over valued since nobody has access to them right now. But, you do bring up a good point...anyone who is delaying a trip until FP comes back should definitely expect to pay for it in some sort of way (whether is be a resort upgrade or a different up-charge or package, etc).

Why? Of course FP should be valued high on your list of a THEME PARK vacation. When capacity grows (which looks like it is already - just saw a vlog today showing a packed Epcot), waiting in each line for 60 min + makes for a horrible vacation experience. Of course, if you are spending $$$$ for 1-2 week vacation (and you are not a local and don't have AP to go every month), avoiding lines is one of the most important criteria in deciding if you would want to go or not. We can also look at it differently. If you are already paying crazy amounts $$$$ for a resort stay, then FP should be included. If you are a AP and local, who can go whenever you want, then you can pay for FPs similar to Maxpass in Disneyland!! Of course, I would actually like FP+ to return to the way it used to be, free for everyone.

 

[LSUfan4444]

Why? Of course FP should be valued high on your list of a THEME PARK vacation. When capacity grows (which looks like it is already - just saw a vlog today showing a packed Epcot), waiting in each line for 60 min + makes for a horrible vacation experience.

So, lets say you were in the park yesterday and you had your three FP selections and so did everyone else. The avg wait time yesterday according to touring plans (park wide) was far below 60 minutes but if everyone had access FP
those standby times would be increased significantly. Lets say you actually ended up grabbing a second tier one FP at some point throughout the day and you were able to do Frozen Ever After and Test Track both with a FP. Yes, on those two attractions you would save time, the second tier FP are basically worthless most of the day and for everything else you do standby, you would wait longer.

If you are only planning half of a park day, yeah.....I can see how the value of three FPs adds more importance but for a full day in the parks they just aren't as important as some people are making them out to be. Because nobody currently has access to them, they aren't as "needed" as they once were...the playing field is different and not having a FP doesnt mean you're in longer lines all day, in fact, the lines are shorter overall (at least in terms of length of time).

ATTRACTION	PREDICTED AVG WAIT (CROWD LEVEL)	OBSERVED AVG WAIT (CROWD LEVEL)	OBSERVED OFFLINE %
Frozen Ever After	54 min ( 4 )	44 min ( 1 )	4%
Gran Fiesta Tour	9 min ( 6 )	6 min ( 2 )	1%
Jrny Imagination	22 min ( 8 )	19 min ( 7 )	0%
Living w/ Land	14 min ( 2 )	11 min ( 1 )	0%
Msn: SPACE Green	16 min ( 6 )	15 min ( 6 )	?
Msn: SPACE Orange	45 min ( 8 )	47 min ( 8 )	0%
Seas with Nemo	15 min ( 2 )	16 min ( 3 )	0%
Soarin'	51 min ( 7 )	47 min ( 6 )	0%
Spaceship Earth	29 min ( 6 )	22 min ( 3 )	1%
Test Track	59 min ( 2 )	53 min ( 1 )

 

[scrappinginontario]

I'm grateful for the discussion here. My family is considering a trip to WDW in early July. We haven't been in several years and are missing it. But, as fans of the big attractions and former FP pros, we really like to minimize line time and maximize big attraction time. We haven't been since the FP Tiers were introduced. It sounds like we should wait longer like maybe next summer, or until the kids can go on a college fall break, instead of being tied to the high school schedule. I think just the uncertainty is enough for me to write off WDW for this summer...not knowing if/when they will reestablish FPs and if there will be a cost and the race to book them if/when that happens. And not knowing what lines will be like; it sounds like they will be bad. I think any travel destinations this summer will be crowded as everyone tries to make up for lost time!

If you’re considering a July vacation I highly recommend keeping an eye on the reservation availability calendar. As of right now it’s wide open after Jul 4 but that can change very quickly. Booking last minute trips (or even those 1-2 months away) is not currently as easy as it used to be. If you look at June’s calendar you will see how important it is to book sooner than later.

 

[disneypharm]

So, lets say you were in the park yesterday and you had your three FP selections and so did everyone else. The avg wait time yesterday according to touring plans (park wide) was far below 60 minutes but if everyone had access FP
those standby times would be increased significantly. Lets say you actually ended up grabbing a second tier one FP at some point throughout the day and you were able to do Frozen Ever After and Test Track both with a FP. Yes, on those two attractions you would save time, the second tier FP are basically worthless most of the day and for everything else you do standby, you would wait longer.

If you are only planning half of a park day, yeah.....I can see how the value of three FPs adds more importance but for a full day in the parks they just aren't as important as some people are making them out to be. Because nobody currently has access to them, they aren't as "needed" as they once were...the playing field is different and not having a FP doesnt mean you're in longer lines all day, in fact, the lines are shorter overall (at least in terms of length of time).

"Because nobody currently has access to them, they aren't as "needed" as they once were." With all the reports that have been posted on these boards (see the ones on rumor and news boards and here now thread", wait times have been very long. Many of them wished they had FP+.

"Yes, on those two attractions you would save time, the second tier FP are basically worthless most of the day and for everything else you do standby, you would wait longer." Why do you assume that other people use FP+ the same as you? With all our trips to WDW pre-pandemic (when large crowds), we never had any problem getting more than 3 FP+ and never had to stand in line for more than 20 minutes (except once on rope drop for FOP - wait for 1 hour).

As I have mentioned before, I think most people who don't want FPs back are those who are last minute travelers (eg, with APs) and local/APs holders. They can't plan their visits and get FPs, so they don't want anyone else to get them, so their standby lines are not longer than what we have now (some 60+ min). It is like saying, since I have to suffer, I want others to do the same! Solution for Disney: free FPs for resort stays (especially for people who spend $$$ on packages), and maxpass for APs and locals. Less people with access to FPs means shorter standby lines.

 

[Mr. Drauer]

"Because nobody currently has access to them, they aren't as "needed" as they once were." With all the reports that have been posted on these boards (see the ones on rumor and news boards and here now thread", wait times have been very long. Many of them wished they had FP+.

"Yes, on those two attractions you would save time, the second tier FP are basically worthless most of the day and for everything else you do standby, you would wait longer." Why do you assume that other people use FP+ the same as you? With all our trips to WDW pre-pandemic (when large crowds), we never had any problem getting more than 3 FP+ and never had to stand in line for more than 20 minutes (except once on rope drop for FOP - wait for 1 hour).

As I have mentioned before, I think most people who don't want FPs back are those who are last minute travelers (eg, with APs) and local/APs holders. They can't plan their visits and get FPs, so they don't want anyone else to get them, so their standby lines are not longer than what we have now (some 60+ min). It is like saying, since I have to suffer, I want others to do the same! Solution for Disney: free FPs for resort stays (especially for people who spend $$$ on packages), and maxpass for APs and locals. Less people with access to FPs means shorter standby lines.

I'm a local AP - pre Covid we might not even plan a park day until I would pull at FP for Slinky or FOP at the drop times, then we would head over. I knew how to play the game and we always road TIer 1 rides multiple times per day on FP. During the no FP time, we have been dozens of times, and found that despite reports and the cries from posters about how bad it is, that wait times are very reasonable. We went to DHS a couple of Sunday's ago and the crowd that day was smaller to us than at any other time during the entire pandemic. Rope drop wait at MMRR was walk on, RnRC next was less than 10 minutes. MFSR was 31 minutes. Star Tours was 18 minutes, our boarding group for RotR was called at 1:00. We left right after. With no FP, the lines actually move. I have no problem with bringing FP back, but I think the pictures and reports represent a significant minority. If you haven't been to the parks during this time, stating what is working and not may be misleading.

 

[luv2cheer92]

AK an dMK have not had tiers for FPs.

Previously HS
Tier 1 RnRC, ToT, SDD
Tier 2 all the others

EPCOT
Tier 1 Soaring, TT, Frozen
Tier 2 all the others

For your FPs, you could pick 1 tier 1 and 2 tier 2. After you used all 3 then you could pick from either tier after that.

AK definitely had tiers. FOP and Navi were Tier 1.

 

[gharter]

AK definitely had tiers. FOP and Navi were Tier 1.

you're right, I forgot about that.

 

[disneypharm]

I'm a local AP - pre Covid we might not even plan a park day until I would pull at FP for Slinky or FOP at the drop times, then we would head over. I knew how to play the game and we always road TIer 1 rides multiple times per day on FP. During the no FP time, we have been dozens of times, and found that despite reports and the cries from posters about how bad it is, that wait times are very reasonable. We went to DHS a couple of Sunday's ago and the crowd that day was smaller to us than at any other time during the entire pandemic. Rope drop wait at MMRR was walk on, RnRC next was less than 10 minutes. MFSR was 31 minutes. Star Tours was 18 minutes, our boarding group for RotR was called at 1:00. We left right after. With no FP, the lines actually move. I have no problem with bringing FP back, but I think the pictures and reports represent a significant minority. If you haven't been to the parks during this time, stating what is working and not may be misleading.

Fair enough. But it is hard to ignore a lot of posts mentioning that wait times were 40-60 min on their vacation in April and March and it is getting worse as capacity is growing.

 

[DizneyFamof4]

FP's is a game changer for our family. We absolutely hated the old FP system where you had to always get to the park early and run to the FP kiosks by each ride to get a FP. That system was biased to the people that went to the parks at opening. We like the parks so much better at night and would rather stay til closed, so we would not arrive until around 10-11 and by that time the FPs for the best rides were mostly all out. Plus the fact you had to have a FP runner in your group. So no thank you on the old FP system.
If WDW does not have any type of FP's it will be horrible, back in 2019 when we went they had shows, meet-n-greets etc. and the popular rides were minimum 90+ minute waits. I could not imagine not having our FP's and knowing that at least we will get 3 of our favorite rides in. I do not like the tiers but we made it work anyways.

 

[ST1TCH]

...
As I have mentioned before, I think most people who don't want FPs back are those who are last minute travelers (eg, with APs) and local/APs holders. They can't plan their visits and get FPs, so they don't want anyone else to get them, so their standby lines are not longer than what we have now (some 60+ min). It is like saying, since I have to suffer, I want others to do the same! Solution for Disney: free FPs for resort stays (especially for people who spend $$$ on packages), and maxpass for APs and locals. Less people with access to FPs means shorter standby lines.

You do get that the flip side of that is the same, right? Someone who wants FP+ because they stay on site and plan months in advance and want their FP's regardless of what it does to the standby lines for those who are local and cannot get a FP in advance...since I'm wise and plan my FP+ way in advance and myself and others like me reserve all of the available FP, those who cannot do so can suffer for all I care.

 

[annadreamsofdisneyworld]

So, lets say you were in the park yesterday and you had your three FP selections and so did everyone else. The avg wait time yesterday according to touring plans (park wide) was far below 60 minutes but if everyone had access FP
those standby times would be increased significantly. Lets say you actually ended up grabbing a second tier one FP at some point throughout the day and you were able to do Frozen Ever After and Test Track both with a FP. Yes, on those two attractions you would save time, the second tier FP are basically worthless most of the day and for everything else you do standby, you would wait longer.

If you are only planning half of a park day, yeah.....I can see how the value of three FPs adds more importance but for a full day in the parks they just aren't as important as some people are making them out to be. Because nobody currently has access to them, they aren't as "needed" as they once were...the playing field is different and not having a FP doesnt mean you're in longer lines all day, in fact, the lines are shorter overall (at least in terms of length of time).

ATTRACTION	PREDICTED AVG WAIT (CROWD LEVEL)	OBSERVED AVG WAIT (CROWD LEVEL)	OBSERVED OFFLINE %
Frozen Ever After	54 min ( 4 )	44 min ( 1 )	4%
Gran Fiesta Tour	9 min ( 6 )	6 min ( 2 )	1%
Jrny Imagination	22 min ( 8 )	19 min ( 7 )	0%
Living w/ Land	14 min ( 2 )	11 min ( 1 )	0%
Msn: SPACE Green	16 min ( 6 )	15 min ( 6 )	?
Msn: SPACE Orange	45 min ( 8 )	47 min ( 8 )	0%
Seas with Nemo	15 min ( 2 )	16 min ( 3 )	0%
Soarin'	51 min ( 7 )	47 min ( 6 )	0%
Spaceship Earth	29 min ( 6 )	22 min ( 3 )	1%
Test Track	59 min ( 2 )	53 min ( 1 )

If I was just going with adults that would be fine, but I know my young kids would struggle to wait in 40-60 minute lines for Frozen Ever After and Test Track. Fast passes are really helpful for families with young children. We only use fast passes or go on rides with low waits. We never get in a line with a wait higher than 30 minutes.

 

[npatellye]

I'm a local AP - pre Covid we might not even plan a park day until I would pull at FP for Slinky or FOP at the drop times, then we would head over. I knew how to play the game and we always road TIer 1 rides multiple times per day on FP. During the no FP time, we have been dozens of times, and found that despite reports and the cries from posters about how bad it is, that wait times are very reasonable. We went to DHS a couple of Sunday's ago and the crowd that day was smaller to us than at any other time during the entire pandemic. Rope drop wait at MMRR was walk on, RnRC next was less than 10 minutes. MFSR was 31 minutes. Star Tours was 18 minutes, our boarding group for RotR was called at 1:00. We left right after. With no FP, the lines actually move. I have no problem with bringing FP back, but I think the pictures and reports represent a significant minority. If you haven't been to the parks during this time, stating what is working and not may be misleading.

Agreed. We’ve been back twice (once at Thanksgiving and then this past week) and we love it without FastPass! We used to use our 3, try for a 4th and 5th, eat, and leave. Without FastPass, we’ve found the lines to be completely manageable, with the longest having been 85 minutes for Tower of Terror. Every other line was shorter than listed. Both trips, we were able to go on every ride we wanted, with some (Thunder Mountain, Mine Train, Peter Pan, Frozen, Runaway Railroad, and Slinky Dog) two or three times by getting off and getting back in line. The lines are constantly moving. My kids are 8 and almost 6 and they did great waiting in line with no complaints.

In terms of FastPass coming back, I wouldn’t be surprised to see a tiered system for number of FastPasses based on resort (and perhaps none free for anyone staying offsite) or a paid system for everyone at a per day, per person flat rate.

 

[disneypharm]

For those who keeps saying that crowds are not that bad, here is the link to another thread about FPs in Disney Rumor and News: https://www.disboards.com/threads/paid-fp-options-coming-soon-to-wdw.3739005/page-167#post-63004064

 

[Mr. Drauer]

For those who keeps saying that crowds are not that bad, here is the link to another thread about FPs in Disney Rumor and News: https://www.disboards.com/threads/paid-fp-options-coming-soon-to-wdw.3739005/page-167#post-63004064

Look - everyone can express their opinion. I can only state mine, as a local who has had an AP for 18 years. We typically will not wait in any line that is longer than 20-25 minutes. We’ve enjoyed the last year without FP even though I love them and know how to maximize them. Once you go to the parks, your opinion of the experience will be valid. People on that thread have been predicting paid FP for a couple of years. If it happens it happens.

 

[disneypharm]

Look - everyone can express their opinion. I can only state mine, as a local who has had an AP for 18 years. We typically will not wait in any line that is longer than 20-25 minutes. We’ve enjoyed the last year without FP even though I love them and know how to maximize them. Once you go to the parks, your opinion of the experience will be valid. People on that thread have been predicting paid FP for a couple of years. If it happens it happens.

Yes, absolutely. Your opinion of the experience is valid as much as other people who experienced something different.

 

[DizneyFamof4]

Agreed. We’ve been back twice (once at Thanksgiving and then this past week) and we love it without FastPass! We used to use our 3, try for a 4th and 5th, eat, and leave. Without FastPass, we’ve found the lines to be completely manageable, with the longest having been 85 minutes for Tower of Terror. Every other line was shorter than listed. Both trips, we were able to go on every ride we wanted, with some (Thunder Mountain, Mine Train, Peter Pan, Frozen, Runaway Railroad, and Slinky Dog) two or three times by getting off and getting back in line. The lines are constantly moving. My kids are 8 and almost 6 and they did great waiting in line with no complaints.

In terms of FastPass coming back, I wouldn’t be surprised to see a tiered system for number of FastPasses based on resort (and perhaps none free for anyone staying offsite) or a paid system for everyone at a per day, per person flat rate.

Yes but those were limited crowds, once everything is fully open, the wait times will definitely increase. Like I said before Covid on our trip in 2019, the popular rides like Slinky, were 90-120+.

BTW, I just looked at Slinky and the current wait time is 70 minutes, with limited crowds and no FPs.

Look - everyone can express their opinion. I can only state mine, as a local who has had an AP for 18 years. We typically will not wait in any line that is longer than 20-25 minutes. We’ve enjoyed the last year without FP even though I love them and know how to maximize them. Once you go to the parks, your opinion of the experience will be valid. People on that thread have been predicting paid FP for a couple of years. If it happens it happens.

But your situation is very unique. The normal family does not have the luxury of sitting at home and picking the days that they can get FP's for rides and decide then, if they are going to the park, unless they want to just stay in their room for most of the trip. Your able to check any day throughout the whole year, where families like ours are only there during a specific and short time frame.