"It's simply gotten too big, too commercial, too regimented"

[mcd2745]

Please share with me your source on this, because I don't believe it.

It was out there when there were raging debates on FP+ a year ago or so. I believe it came from Rasulo on some conference call one time. FP- was only used by only about 40% of all guests who entered the parks. They believed they can get FP+ usage up to around 80-85% of all who enter the parks.

 

[rteetz]

It was out there when there were raging debates on FP+ a year ago or so. I believe it came from Rasulo on some conference call one time. FP- was only used by only about 40% of all guests who entered the parks. They believed they can get FP+ usage up to around 80-85% of all who enter the parks.

Yes I do remember that was said by rasulo that legacy FP was about 40% and they wanted much more than that with FP+.

 

[Andrew015]

It was out there when there were raging debates on FP+ a year ago or so. I believe it came from Rasulo on some conference call one time. FP- was only used by only about 40% of all guests who entered the parks. They believed they can get FP+ usage up to around 80-85% of all who enter the parks.

Here's the misleading FACTS behind this statistic. Guests only NEEDED to use Legacy FP ~40% of the time, because that's about all that is really worth utilizing a FP for. Disney is FORCING the use of FP+ on guests, and some of that inflated 80-85% will be for rides like Small World or Imagination, in which a FP is not truly needed, but is required as part of your selection of "3". This is nothing more than fancy salesmanship to help justify the $1+ billion dollar investment that is not meant to enhance the guest's experience, but rather, track their movements, spending habits, and last but not least, spread around the crowds. If we're going to throw around these types of statements / statistics, let's at least put them into context and call a spade a spade.

 

[Laketravis]

I tend to agree with that line of thought. In fact, there's a way they could ensure that 100% of guests utilize it, thus claiming an overwhelming success in the process - just make some attractions FP only.

Here's the misleading FACTS behind this statistic. Guests only NEEDED to use Legacy FP ~40% of the time, because that's about all that is really worth utilizing a FP for. Disney is FORCING the use of FP+ on guests, and some of that inflated 80-85% will be for rides like Small World or Imagination, in which a FP is not truly needed, but is required as part of your selection of "3". This is nothing more than fancy salesmanship to help justify the $1+ billion dollar investment that is not meant to enhance the guest's experience, but rather, track their movements, spending habits, and last but not least, spread around the crowds. If we're going to throw around these types of statements / statistics, let's at least put them into context and call a spade a spade.

 

[Laketravis]

I wouldn't say that at all. They are two separate trips. I was in Orlando earlier in November and didn't go to either.

I suppose another way to say it is that we are going to Uni "exclusively" on our next trip. So at least in our case I don't consider Uni to be an overflow park for WDW.

BTW - we've never been to Uni so I really don't know what to expect when we get there. Perhaps the true test will be when we go back to Orlando for a couple of weeks in March when all we have right now is a condo reservation and AP's to both - we'll see which one we end up going to based on these two most recent experiences. WDW, Uni, or both.

You just got back from Disney World. (enjoyed your trip reports btw). So you're not going "in lieu of" Disney but "in addition to".

 

[MrInfinity]

Here's the misleading FACTS behind this statistic. Guests only NEEDED to use Legacy FP ~40% of the time, because that's about all that is really worth utilizing a FP for.

It wasn't that guests used it 40% of the time. It was that only 40% of guests used it at all.

 

[Laketravis]

I don't think the old system was as heavily promoted as FP+ has been, if at all.

 

[Andrew015]

It wasn't that guests used it 40% of the time. It was that only 40% of guests used it at all.

The official transcript of the Q2 earnings call in which Rasulo made this statement did not specify a 40% increase in # of guests using the system.

"Historically, guests who pre-plan spend more time at our parks, so we like these early trends. MyMagic+ has also increased the engagement with FastPass+ by 40% relative to the legacy FastPass system, and allowed us to increase the number of guests we can accommodate during peak periods."

http://cdn.media.ir.thewaltdisneycompany.com/2014/q2/q2-fy14-earnings-transcript.pdf

If I had to hazard a guess, I would say that it's a 40% increase in overall usage. Regardless, I always question these types of statistics. What is the baseline statistic that they are using for the comparison? What constitutes "conversion" (1 FP+ usage over a 7 night stay)? These types of statistics are only used to do one thing: excite shareholders, which is probably a difficult thing to do when trying to justify the existence of a $1+ Billion dollar investment that doesn't generate revenue or sell more Mickey ears in the gift shops.

 

[Andrew015]

I don't think the old system was as heavily promoted as FP+ has been, if at all.

Bingo.

 

[mcd2745]

It wasn't that guests used it 40% of the time. It was that only 40% of guests used it at all.

The official transcript of the Q2 earnings call in which Rasulo made this statement did not specify a 40% increase in # of guests using the system.

"Historically, guests who pre-plan spend more time at our parks, so we like these early trends. MyMagic+ has also increased the engagement with FastPass+ by 40% relative to the legacy FastPass system, and allowed us to increase the number of guests we can accommodate during peak periods."

http://cdn.media.ir.thewaltdisneycompany.com/2014/q2/q2-fy14-earnings-transcript.pdf

If I had to hazard a guess, I would say that it's a 40% increase in overall usage. Regardless, I always question these types of statistics. What is the baseline statistic that they are using for the comparison? What constitutes "conversion" (1 FP+ usage over a 7 night stay)? These types of statistics are only used to do one thing: excite shareholders, which is probably a difficult thing to do when trying to justify the existence of a $1+ Billion dollar investment that doesn't generate revenue or sell more Mickey ears in the gift shops.

After a little digging, I found that the statistic I was referencing was actually that legacy FP was used by "less than" 50% (so probably just under 50%) of guests. Also,for those that did use it, they used on average two FP- per day. This came from an Orlando Sentinel article at the beginning of 2014 - well before the Rasulo comment in May (unfortunately can't link to it without being a subscriber). The Rasulo comment of increasing FP participation by 40% seems to back that up.

What I recall now is that when I first read the article 10 months or so ago, I thought the statistic that those who used used FP- only used an average of 2 per day was more significant than the "less than 50%" of people using it stat. To me, it meant that probably in Disney's eyes, giving you 3 FP+ per day was a 50% increase on the 2 FP- that people - on average - were using. Of course, the problem here on the DISboards, is that very few, if any of us, would be characterized as "average" guests.

 

[Andrew015]

What I recall now is that when I first read the article 10 months or so ago, I thought the statistic that those who used used FP- only used an average of 2 per day was more significant than the "less than 50%" of people using it stat. To me, it meant that probably in Disney's eyes, giving you 3 FP+ per day was a 50% increase on the 2 FP- that people - on average - were using.

This fact (if true) that 50% of park goers were only using (on average) 2 legacy FP's per day only further illustrates the crux of the real problem: that Disney doesn't have enough FP worthy attractions, and rather than fix the real problem, a band-aide (FP+) was placed over it forcing people to ride otherwise unpopular attractions.

 

[KimbaLovesDisney]

I feel in the middle on this. I always enjoyed the planing of my trips. Hunting out the best bargains, and finding a way to make the most of our trips to my happy place. But since the meal plans came into play, getting a table seating if you stay out of the park, and or are not on meal plan is very limiting. The meals are higher priced to make those getting the plans feel like they are getting a better deal. And even calling months in advance, there is no availability. That takes away from being able to be flexible and pop into any table service if you haven't made a reservation. I fear that the FP system is going to be much the same. I do feel like being able to just go and enjoy the day, see where you end up and what rides you take, what food you eat isnt going to be possible anymore. I will still enjoy the magic, i hope this year. We will see.

 

[Suvadoo]

This fact (if true) that 50% of park goers were only using (on average) 2 legacy FP's per day only further illustrates the crux of the real problem: that Disney doesn't have enough FP worthy attractions, and rather than fix the real problem, a band-aide (FP+) was placed over it forcing people to ride otherwise unpopular attractions.

Yup, FP+ would be a lot more palatable if they actually had better attractions. I also think FP+ would be a lot better now if they increased the return time from 1 hour to 2 hours. I don't think I'd feel so over scheduled if Disney would loosen their rules a bit.

 

[BelleBriarRose]

I have mixed feelings about the issues in this article. On one hand, the new systems are designed for people who like me who come about once a year: I can plan ahead and have a guaranteed spot on certain rides and reservations at certain restaurants. For me, that relieves a good amount of the stress.

However, traveling with kids requires more flexibility than traveling as a couple, so I can understand how the emphasis on adhering to a schedule would be stressful. I can also understand how annual passholders who live in the area and like spontaneous trips to Disney would find this system frustrating, since they probably won't be able to get the fastpasses or reservations they want.

Still, I'm giving Disney the benefit of the doubt that they'll make this system better and come up with a compromise that is better, even if it will never be perfect. In the meantime, I am not letting anything spoil my Disney fun!

 

[KYMickey]

We don't.
1/2M members in total over the last 10 years of disboards existence. That's all members who have come or gone. Well, 16M visitors to the MK per year over that time is 160M. Now, 1/2M of those on the disboards is, as I said, less than 1%. Of the 1/2M, I see maybe 10 or 20 people who post MOST of the posts out here (hehe lately I've been one of them, but only cuz I'm excited that we just booked a new trip). There's probly a situation such that 20% of the disboard users have made 80% of the posts.

I certainly agree that the number of people on this board are a small percentage of the total the visit Disney. On the other hand the majority of people who participate in this board are Disney fanatics and drink the rosy Kool-Aid! Disney walks on water in their book. If this could with people feel that there are problems with the system how it exists today casual visitors probably feel even stronger and are less likely to continue spending large sums of money.

I like to use my smartphone, and was on it in 2012 even before FP+. But also, I did not use it any more in 2014. FP's I locked in at home, and in-park ones you have to do at a Kiosk. I still picked parks based on ADRs, not Fast Passes. You still don't have to book anything. You can have it auto-pick some rides for you, and if you want to, you can even pull 3 FP- tickets before you ever even reach the park. Then, there's tons of availability on everything but SDMT and A&E up to the day of to change them if you wish.

Remember the chicken and egg here. Disney is not implementing a system... which is then requiring people to be on their smartphone. Rather, Disney knows people are glued to their smartphone... so they are bringing FastPass to them in the preferred technology of today.

That may be your and Disney's feelings but many people are glued to their smartphones for work and would prefer to get away from them when on vacation.

Having to pick parks on a given day based on ADRs or FPs is one of the big things I've pointed out as being a major problem! You can no longer get up on Tuesday morning and decide you want to spend the day at Epcot if you have all of your preplanned reservations for Magic Kingdom. Certainly removes all spontaneity from your vacation.

 

[Whatsthegoodword]

We are leaving for Uni in three weeks, going to spend the week of New Year's there. Even though we have WDW AP's, we won't be setting foot at WDW. Not even once.

I've been to WDW on New Year's Eve, and you couldn't pay me to go back then. I've never been in a place so uncomfortably stuffed with people. That being said, I love WDW, and plan to go back in early June. Now, to my question:

Are you serious that you're going to Universal Studios for whole week? Seriously? ...or is this just conjecture? I don't think I could find enough to keep me busy there for two days, much less a week. I enjoy US - the HP parts at least, but a week?

 

[beer dave]

I have never seen a more even poll.

 

[beer dave]

I certainly agree that the number of people on this board are a small percentage of the total the visit Disney. On the other hand the majority of people who participate in this board are Disney fanatics and drink the rosy Kool-Aid! Disney walks on water in their book. If this could with people feel that there are problems with the system how it exists today casual visitors probably feel even stronger and are less likely to continue spending large sums of money.


.

Sounds like we need another poll.

 

[Laketravis]

Are you serious that you're going to Universal Studios for whole week? Seriously? ...or is this just conjecture? I don't think I could find enough to keep me busy there for two days, much less a week. I enjoy US - the HP parts at least, but a week?

12/30-1/5, a bit shy of a full week.

Seriously.

 

[7KLucky]

In our many trips I have been caught up in the business of following a schedule and rushing from "appointment to appointment" so I can certainly understand the article.

I have also been able to remove myself from that business like behavior and just sit back and be a kid with my kids. It is what you make of it. I stay on property so I can benefit from early entry and late stay, FP+ reservations, etc.... but with a little planning and a chill attitude it can still be magical.

As for commercialism..... as lousy as that is for the common folk- saving every penny to reach the few days of "vacation", in reality its how the world is. Even Walmart, in their effort to be the cheapest, is all about making the all mighty buck.

I choose MAGIC! I choose to chill! I choose to have fun.