I haven't chimed in too much on this thread thus far because I find that everyone else is making their points quite well (and very articulately), no matter what 'side' of the AP holder /crowd controlissue they may support, and there is not too much else I can contribute without being redundant. I think this has been a fascinating discussion - one which has kept me glued to my chair, reading along with every post - and I
hope that it can continue in such a diplomatic way where that the overall 'tone' of the thread as a whole does not make anyone feel persecuted or angry, and is not perceived to be imflammatory in any way.
I agree that it is important to discuss what trends or cirsumstances may affect crowd levels at DLR, and I don't want to have to lock this thread because it starts getting too heated.
As it relates to AP price increases and overall perceived value of a DLR vacation/trip......
I was thinking recently about the ever-climbing prices of Goofy's Kitchen. Now, most of you know that I am a long-time (17-year) devotee of Goofy's Kitchen, but there is no getting around the fact that the prices are high and it makes a big dent in my wallet. When we used to eat there
twice in one weekend trip, the breakfast buffet prices were in the range of $13.00 - $15.00 (and there
may have even been a few more characters on duty in those days than there are now)!!! That's a far cry from today's 'off-peak' rates of $32 and change per adult!
Still, Goofy's is part of our overall DLR experience. It's a tradition that we seem to be maintaining even as the prices creep slowly up...up....up...and up again. Truth be told, if money were no object, we would probably still be eating there twice on every trip. We like it that much. So the other day I found myself wondering at what point would I consider the price to be too high to eat at Goofy's? Would it be too expensive for us at, say, $40 for breakfast? $50? Would DLR dare to raise the Goofy's breakfast prices to over $50 in the next decade, and if they did, would we still eat there? And the answer was:
I am not sure!! If something is such an important part of my/our overall DLR experience and has been for so long, I don't know if I could easily eliminate it from the agenda, even at a stratospheric price, but at some point reality would likely set in and hit me over the head to make me question if we were crazy to spend that much on breakfast.
However, along those lines....another integral part of my overall DLR experience has been to stay onsite. We have stayed onsite since 1987, and have never ventured offsite - neither to eat nor to sleep. Yes, I live in Los Angeles, a mere 45 - 90 minutes away from DLR, but I don't get to DLR all that often, unfortunately, nor does my friend and DLR 'partner in crime' who lives
in Anaheim, 5 minutes away from DLR (she doesn't love DLR like I do)!! We could easily just go to our homes at the end of the night and not stay overnight anywhere. But to get the full DLR vacation experience and Disney immersion, staying at one of the 3 DLR hotels has become essential for us, not to mention it is very convenient in terms of providing a place for the mid-day rest breaks, and also, allowing us to extend our DLR trips over the course of a few days rather than a one-day trip......
BUT, I now find myself thinking that I am getting close to reaching my
'how expensive is too expensive' threshold in DLR hotel rates. As much as I LOVE staying onsite and as important as it has been to our DLR trips, the rates are now
way too high
without any kind of a PIN code offer or nifty AP rate to fall back on. Again, I suppose if money were NO object at all I would just plunk down my cash in a split second and not worry about whether or not the DLR hotels were too expensive. I would just do it - because I like to stay onsite, because it adds to the magic, because it enhances my experience, because it is convenient...all of those reasons. For right now, though, I am starting to
consider off-site options JUST IN CASE there are no fabulous AP rates coming out for the times of year I want (October and December). They just may price me right out of being a loyal DLR hotel guest (which I think is what's happened with many guests)!!
So the reason I bring up Goofy's prices and my DLR hotel rate crisis is because it all ties into this discussion of the APs
and the new price increase. How expensive is TOO expensive for the overall experience? I got VERY lucky in that I got my Premium AP last year for only $191 due to extra unused tickets I had sitting around, which I applied to the total price of the PAP. I didn't have to pay full price like other folks did, and because I got such a good deal on it, I haven't felt too 'guilty' about not being able to make it to DLR as much as I would have hoped to this year. If I had paid full price, I would have felt terrible about not getting to DLR often. For the number of days I spent in the park in 2008, the AP more than paid back the $191 I spent, PLUS, as Disney Dreams noted above, the discounts I got were a
huge perk and lure for me. Applying 15% towards that hefty Goofy's bill was very helpful, and getting a fantastic AP rate for the PPH in December - right before Christmas - was amazing! Those things right there made me realize I made an excellent decision to get the PAP in the first place (I also used it for discounts on a couple of merchandise items too).
But, alas....AP renewal time draws near...October 2nd, to be exact. So far, the current hotel rates showing on the AP calendar for October are what I consider too expensive for me to even bother with if I got for Halloweentime. So off-site is looking mighty tempting at this point. As for whether or not I will renew the PAP.....Yes, I have some more unused tickets that I could apply to the overall price to renew and get another good deal, even with the heavy $40 hike, but I am not sure if I will. I had planned on likely having to pay full price, but maybe on the payment/installment plan. If I don't see any good AP hotel rates popping up for October, then that lessens my desire to want to renew the AP at all then. The $40 increase also lessens my desire to want to renew the AP. I am now in that quandary of, 'Is it worth it to renew at those prices? Is it worth to renew if I DON'T stay onsite and if I DON'T go to DLR too many times during the next year? Is it a good value overall - for me, personally - or have I just finally reached my threshold?' I don't know the answers yet. I feel that I am forced into having to now 'downsize' or minimize my own overall DLR experience because the prices are getting so lofty, but the wonderful, magical times I have had at DL/DLR since 1972 have been so immeasurable and incomparable in my life in different ways that it is hard to bring myself to the point of saying, "Okay...enough is enough..."
I think those people who reallllllllly needed the PAPs in the past will probably suck it up and buy the PAPs again, even at the new $429 price, because it will be worth it to them as a whole, and it is a great overall value. Maybe they will opt for the monthly payment plan, but they will do it. Others, I feel, will 'drop down' a notch to Deluxe, just to have something with which to obtain food and hotel discounts and fewer block out days, with the intention of upgrading down the road if necessary. I think the crowd problems DLR has been having in 2009 will be just as bad in 2010 because the lower level AP holders will still have the same block out days and will still flock to the parks at the same times (and World of Color is coming, so watch out!).
If DLR thought that raising the PAP by $40 would cut down on crowds, I think they were wrong (maybe that was not even in their thought process, so I am just saying
if). It may alienate a lot of folks and make them angry, but it won't do much to cut down on crowds in the big picture. In my opinion, all personal feelings about price increases aside, from a business standpoint, it would have made more sense (as Pink Budgie suggested) to just change the block out days on each SoCal AP - and the Deluxe AP - so they didn't coincide at all, OR make it more difficult to purchase an AP in the first place, either by raising the prices of
all the APs
substantially OR by eliminating the monthly payment option altogether (for
all levels of AP) - or all of the above.
I always wondered how everyone "knew" that it was AP holders that were the rude, obnoxious guests. So much of this is in an individuals attitude towards their experience. I adore Disneyland! Yes, I have run into rude people (and yes I have been cranky myself, at times), but overall everyone just wants to have fun and make memories with their family and friends. It is possible to plan around crowds (and AP holders). I try to share tips with people I see and talk with in line to make their experience a pleasant one. One other note about crowds, I have met some really great people while standing in those long lines.
It isn't always a bad thing. Happy planning, everyone!
