When do you think the border will reopen?

[Retro Magic]

We're booked September 7-21st at Polynesian. If we can fly I'm still happy to go as I feel safe there. But I suppose we'll have to wait and see how things go. Things seem to change daily.

 

[stfxkid]

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...-americans-fined-ontario-police-a9602796.html
Good to see them enforcing the rules.

Should have hit them with the maximum penalty.

"Penalties under the Quarantine Act include six months in prison or a fine of up to $750,000, which could go up to $1 million if the person caused death or bodily harm by wilfully and recklessly breaking the rules. " https://toronto.citynews.ca/2020/07...nada-fined-1000-for-violating-quarantine-act/

 

[Silvermist999]

What is interesting to me is that the Jays flew into Toronto to start training and checked into the Toronto Marriott hotel last night. Are they also required to self-isolate for 14 days especially having just returned from Florida?

 

[Jrb1979]

What is interesting to me is that the Jays flew into Toronto to start training and checked into the Toronto Marriott hotel last night. Are they also required to self-isolate for 14 days especially having just returned from Florida?

As I have heard they have to self-isolate for the 14 days before they can start training

 

[Iralyn]

What is interesting to me is that the Jays flew into Toronto to start training and checked into the Toronto Marriott hotel last night. Are they also required to self-isolate for 14 days especially having just returned from Florida?

I believe they have been allowed a self-isolation 'bubble'. They must stay at the hotel that is attached to the Rogers Centre but are allowed to interact with other players and coaches and workout at the Rogers Centre but are not allowed to go out into the community at all. It seems to me that there is potential for some community leaks with local workers they will presumably be interacting with during this time but hopefully all will be well. I hope that they only do training camp and do not allow other teams to enter Canada to play against them.

 

[wdwmom3]

What is interesting to me is that the Jays flew into Toronto to start training and checked into the Toronto Marriott hotel last night. Are they also required to self-isolate for 14 days especially having just returned from Florida?

I believe they will be isolating. Only going in the hotel and the dome for training. But they were also all tested and they will continue to be tested.

 

[mshanson3121]

Ok I may have misheard this. So sorry if it’s not true. But it sounds like the recent cases in PEI have been traced back to someone who travelled to another province who visited with someone who had been in the US. This makes me mad. Was the person not under quarantine?

This is why we have to keep the borders closed!!

From CBC:

Cluster tied to Nova Scotia travel

The starting point of the outbreak was a man in his 20s who had travelled to Nova Scotia and appears to have contracted COVID-19 from someone there who had recently been in the U.S.

The person who had been to the U.S. was travelling on a student visa and was on his way to P.E.I., Nova Scotia Premier Stephen McNeil said in a news briefing Monday afternoon. However, he said the man was denied entry at the Confederation Bridge because he did not have the required pre-screening approval.

McNeil said the man flew from the United States to Toronto, then transferred to a flight to Halifax. Under the circumstances, he was supposed to self-isolate but did not.


And this is the danger of asymptomatic cases - one man, has infected those 5 people (and that number will of course likely end up higher) and has over 10 other people (close contacts of the 5) in self-isolation for 14 days. Or, again, we can look at the outbreak in Campbellton - almost 30 people infected and two deaths, because of one man. This is why masks are so important, and they're calling to make them legally mandatory across Canada in ALL public space, and this is why Disney (and any other similar venue) is so risky. And, this is why I hope they do not open the US border any time this year.

 

[ilovetotravel1977]

Has anyone here cancelled their Air Canada booking online themselves? The website says:

If you booked directly with Air Canada (including aircanada.com, the Air Canada Mobile App, and our Contact Centres) or Kayak, Google Flights, and Skyscanner, you can convert your booking by visiting Manage My Booking.

I just don't want to completely screw it up and not get my travel vouchers!

 

[hdrolfe]

Has anyone here cancelled their Air Canada booking online themselves? The website says:

If you booked directly with Air Canada (including aircanada.com, the Air Canada Mobile App, and our Contact Centres) or Kayak, Google Flights, and Skyscanner, you can convert your booking by visiting Manage My Booking.

I just don't want to completely screw it up and not get my travel vouchers!

So here's the thing. You can call, and wait a long time to get through, in order to cancel right off the bat. Or you can do the online way and if it works, fabulous! And if it doesn't, you have to call and wait a long time to get through. Personally, I'd do it online and see what happens before I call. But I also hate calling places when there is an online version.

 

[Kaadk]

Should have hit them with the maximum penalty.

"Penalties under the Quarantine Act include six months in prison or a fine of up to $750,000, which could go up to $1 million if the person caused death or bodily harm by wilfully and recklessly breaking the rules. " https://toronto.citynews.ca/2020/07...nada-fined-1000-for-violating-quarantine-act/

I can't seem to find the relevant article now, but the one that I read wasn't as harsh on the couple. According to it, the stops they did were at places like a grocery store. Yes, they shouldn't have stopped, and yes, they should be fined for stopping, but throwing a pair of senior citizens in jail for making a few mistakes is a bit of overkill. After all, it's not the same thing as the Banff situation where the tourists were purposely flouting the rules. Those in the Banff situation I could say should have the book thrown at them, but this couple just made a few mistakes. Potentially life threatening mistakes if they were carriers, but still, mistakes none the less.

 

[tinkerone]

I can't seem to find the relevant article now, but the one that I read wasn't as harsh on the couple. According to it, the stops they did were at places like a grocery store. Yes, they shouldn't have stopped, and yes, they should be fined for stopping, but throwing a pair of senior citizens in jail for making a few mistakes is a bit of overkill. After all, it's not the same thing as the Banff situation where the tourists were purposely flouting the rules. Those in the Banff situation I could say should have the book thrown at them, but this couple just made a few mistakes. Potentially life threatening mistakes if they were carriers, but still, mistakes none the less.

Sorry but I'm not in total agreement with this. 'Stops' indicate more than one. You certainly don't need to stop at more than one grocery store. They knew the rules coming in and decided to disobey. Doesn't really matter that they are seniors, if they committed murder (which actually this could be) it would not matter that they are seniors. That's not an excuse.
No matter how you look at it, by knowing the rules and saying yes they would obey to enter the country, they are indeed fluting the rules. They are putting us at risk for their own enjoyment. That's not okay.
JMO only.

 

[ilovetotravel1977]

As seniors, they should be even MORE aware of their actions as people are trying to protect them from getting sick as they are supposedly in the more effected category.

 

[mshanson3121]

I can't seem to find the relevant article now, but the one that I read wasn't as harsh on the couple. According to it, the stops they did were at places like a grocery store. Yes, they shouldn't have stopped, and yes, they should be fined for stopping, but throwing a pair of senior citizens in jail for making a few mistakes is a bit of overkill. After all, it's not the same thing as the Banff situation where the tourists were purposely flouting the rules. Those in the Banff situation I could say should have the book thrown at them, but this couple just made a few mistakes. Potentially life threatening mistakes if they were carriers, but still, mistakes none the less.

Sorry but I'm not in total agreement with this. 'Stops' indicate more than one. You certainly don't need to stop at more than one grocery store. They knew the rules coming in and decided to disobey. Doesn't really matter that they are seniors, if they committed murder (which actually this could be) it would not matter that they are seniors. That's not an excuse.
No matter how you look at it, by knowing the rules and saying yes they would obey to enter the country, they are indeed fluting the rules. They are putting us at risk for their own enjoyment. That's not okay.
JMO only.

What Tinkerone said, 100%. Their age is no excuse. A senior citizen drives drunk and kills someone - do we excuse them just because they're 65 years old? I assure you, 65 year-olds are still perfectly capable of knowing and following the laws. And in this case - they not only knew the law, they purposely chose to ignore it. The law in Canada is, when you're travelling and you're obligated to self-quarantine, you are not allowed ANY stops.

 

[Kaadk]

Sorry but I'm not in total agreement with this. 'Stops' indicate more than one. You certainly don't need to stop at more than one grocery store. They knew the rules coming in and decided to disobey. Doesn't really matter that they are seniors, if they committed murder (which actually this could be) it would not matter that they are seniors. That's not an excuse.
No matter how you look at it, by knowing the rules and saying yes they would obey to enter the country, they are indeed fluting the rules. They are putting us at risk for their own enjoyment. That's not okay.
JMO only.

I agree they broke the rules, I agree that it isn't excusable. I believe they should have been fined. I just don't agree with the post I was responding to that said they should have been given the maximum penalty. None of the articles I've read about the situation indicate it was "for their own enjoyment" as you mentioned. Those stops could have just as easily been for groceries, gas, and some take out. Course, I don't know for sure what those stops actually were, but, I could easily see them not understanding the rules about "straight to your destination" to really mean "straight to your destination, with no stops for anything, what so ever."

In the Banff situation, yes, it was "for their own enjoyment", admitted as such by their own words and as such, those people should have been given the maximum penalty. But with these people, there's no proof they were stopping "for their own enjoyment" and as such, I was rebutting against the post that said they should have received the maximum. They probably should have been charged more than they were, just not as harsh as 'the maximum' as suggested, without knowing the whole story.

 

[tinkerone]

I agree they broke the rules, I agree that it isn't excusable. I believe they should have been fined. I just don't agree with the post I was responding to that said they should have been given the maximum penalty. None of the articles I've read about the situation indicate it was "for their own enjoyment" as you mentioned. Those stops could have just as easily been for groceries, gas, and some take out. Course, I don't know for sure what those stops actually were, but, I could easily see them not understanding the rules about "straight to your destination" to really mean "straight to your destination, with no stops for anything, what so ever."

In the Banff situation, yes, it was "for their own enjoyment", admitted as such by their own words and as such, those people should have been given the maximum penalty. But with these people, there's no proof they were stopping "for their own enjoyment" and as such, I was rebutting against the post that said they should have received the maximum. They probably should have been charged more than they were, just not as harsh as 'the maximum' as suggested, without knowing the whole story.

As quoted in the article I read "Along with other stipulations, the two were instructed by the Canada Border Services Agency to drive directly to their destination and remain there for 14 days without delay". Pretty clear and if they weren't actually clear at that point then they should have questioned what 'straight to your destination' meant. Article is http://www.netnewsledger.com/2020/0...n-fort-frances-with-violating-quarantine-act/

I'm not saying they should get the max but I certainly don't see why they shouldn't either. Maybe a few news articles stating that Americans were fined $750,000 would help them understand what driving directly to their destination means. There is no excuse, period. And yes, if they made any stops after stating to customs that they wouldn't then they are stopping for their own enjoyment.

Lets agree to disagree.

 

[wdwmom3]

As quoted in the article I read "Along with other stipulations, the two were instructed by the Canada Border Services Agency to drive directly to their destination and remain there for 14 days without delay". Pretty clear and if they weren't actually clear at that point then they should have questioned what 'straight to your destination' meant. Article is http://www.netnewsledger.com/2020/0...n-fort-frances-with-violating-quarantine-act/

I'm not saying they should get the max but I certainly don't see why they shouldn't either. Maybe a few news articles stating that Americans were fined $750,000 would help them understand what driving directly to their destination means. There is no excuse, period. And yes, if they made any stops after stating to customs that they wouldn't then they are stopping for their own enjoyment.

Lets agree to disagree.

I don’t think they should be thrown in jail. But I do agree with a high fine, maybe $2500 each. And they should be flagged by customs and possibly refused entry in the future since they disobeyed the instructions given by customs.

I think it will just take a handful of people paying larger fines and possibly being banned from entry in the future, would do a lot to stop other people from ignoring the rules.

I’m sorry there is no excuse for what they did considering they were told exactly what they had to do.

 

[Best_Vacation_EVER!]

I don’t think they should be thrown in jail. But I do agree with a high fine, maybe $2500 each. And they should be flagged by customs and possibly refused entry in the future since they disobeyed the instructions given by customs.

I think it will just take a handful of people paying larger fines and possibly being banned from entry in the future, would do a lot to stop other people from ignoring the rules.

I’m sorry there is no excuse for what they did considering they were told exactly what they had to do.

Agree with this totally. Canada has followed the shelter in place, wearing masks and waiting in lines, business losses, job losses, etc... The cost to Canadians financially, socially, etc... has been high but for the most part we've done what needed to be done. I have zero sympathy for those who come to the country and can't respect our quarantine rules --- I don't care if you're 20 or 60 or older -- if the terms of entry to Canada were to quarantine and you don't -- you shouldn't be allowed back. Which other rules/laws are you going to pick and choose to respect while you're here?

 

[Pumpkin1172]

I don’t think they should be thrown in jail. But I do agree with a high fine, maybe $2500 each. And they should be flagged by customs and possibly refused entry in the future since they disobeyed the instructions given by customs.

I think the fines should be 5,000 - 10,000 per person. It will make them take notice and rethink their travel plans.

We have sacrificed lots in doing our part to flatten the curve. All our governments acted immediately when they seen new cases start to rise even in the slightest. They traced and tracked people to know where it was and how it is spreading. I'm not even sure how the US can trace and track anymore when you have 11,000+ new cases in one state in a day!!!! When you think of the population density it isn't a huge number because there are way more people in the US than Canada. But I still don't want to see how much more their numbers will climb in the next 2-3 months

 

[wdwmom3]

I think the fines should be 5,000 - 10,000 per person. It will make them take notice and rethink their travel plans.

We have sacrificed lots in doing our part to flatten the curve. All our governments acted immediately when they seen new cases start to rise even in the slightest. They traced and tracked people to know where it was and how it is spreading. I'm not even sure how the US can trace and track anymore when you have 11,000+ new cases in one state in a day!!!! When you think of the population density it isn't a huge number because there are way more people in the US than Canada. But I still don't want to see how much more their numbers will climb in the next 2-3 months

I think the main thing should be they are denied entry in the future. I would be ok with a $5000 fine. But really these fines may never get paid. Telling someone they can never come back here is a different story. Especially if they have family or friends here.

They can’t trace the contacts when they have that many cases. It’s impossible so it’s just going to get worse. And I’ve been reading on other boards that some places people are now having to wait a week to 10 days for their results because they have so many tests to do. And there are reports of people not even bothering to isolate while waiting for results .

I would like to blame this on the “leadership” or lack there of. But when you hear stuff like that you can only blame the general public. I think the people who actually take this seriously in the US are now in the minority.

 

[shameless3]

I think the main thing should be they are denied entry in the future. I would be ok with a $5000 fine. But really these fines may never get paid. Telling someone they can never come back here is a different story. Especially if they have family or friends here.

They can’t trace the contacts when they have that many cases. It’s impossible so it’s just going to get worse. And I’ve been reading on other boards that some places people are now having to wait a week to 10 days for their results because they have so many tests to do. And there are reports of people not even bothering to isolate while waiting for results .

I would like to blame this on the “leadership” or lack there of. But when you hear stuff like that you can only blame the general public. I think the people who actually take this seriously in the US are now in the minority.

I am in NS where the selfish idiot from the USA was caught not self isolating. This person had spread covid to at least 5 people (who knows who else has it and is currently unaware) before getting caught. I think any person coming from the USA and does not self isolate should be fined a minimum of $10,000 each and deported after fees are paid - not leinancy.

I also don't give any leeway to people travelling in our country. Go directly to your home upon arrival is quite clear. If you can't have groceries delivered to your home somehow, maybe you should reconsider coming for a visit. This also applies to people within Canada coming to the Atlantic bubble - maybe you should not visit this year if you can't self isolate for two weeks on arrival. We were 3 weeks without a case until people out of province and country showed up here.

I get that people want to visit or travel - so do I. Bit this is a different time and everyone has to adapt for the short term.