The Running Thread - 2020

[michigandergirl]

Running means meditation
Running energizes me
Running tires me

 

[GreatLakes]

So, one of our local race series announced they are starting in person racing for their July 4th race.

Some of the directions:

What time does the event start?
We will have waves of 25, spaced apart every 2 minutes beginning at 9:00am. You will have a chip start and finish.

Are there awards on race day?
Due to the current circumstances surrounding Covid-19, there will be no awards presented on race day. Awards can be picked up at Second Sole Mentor at a later date TBD. Award winners will be contacted via email.

Pre-Race Guidelines
- Participants must be symptom free of illness for 14 days (June 20th & after). Symptomatic individuals MUST stay at home.

- Participants traveling to event are recommended to travel alone or with members of immediate family only.

- Participants must wear shirt and shoes at all times.

- Hand sanitizer stations will be provided at the start and finish line areas.

- Bottled water will be available at the finish line. We highly recommend carrying your own water as there will NOT be a water stop on the course.


During Race Guidelines
- No spitting, snotting, or projections of any bodily fluid before, during or after event.

- Restroom accommodations will be available on the concourse of the stadium.

- All participants must avoid any physical contact with other participants which includes high fives, fist bumps, huddles, or other close contact before, during, or after the event.

- During competition, participants must abide by the six-foot mandated social distancing regulations when passing other participants.

- Upon finishing the race, participants must head directly to their vehicles. No congregating at finish line and/or parking areas.

- Spectators are not permitted on course, at start line, finish line, or parking areas.

- Family members finishing at separate times cannot wait at finish line for other family members.

Thank you for your support!

It's still too soon for me but if things go well maybe we will have smaller races after all. This one finishes on the field of a minor league baseball stadium so plenty of room to socially distance. They also historically close the roads completely to traffic in both directions so plenty of room to spread out with the waves.

 

[JediKnightXan]

Running creates sweat

 

[KSellers88]

Running reduces anxiety.

Speaking of races starting back, we had our first local race since March this weekend. There were a total of around 200 runners who participated and I felt like it was very well organized and safe. They assigned groups of 20 runners a specific start time and you were not supposed to get to the start line until 5 minutes prior to your assigned time. They let 20 runners go every 10 minutes and had markers for people to stand on in the start corral that were spaced 6 feet apart. There was no water on the course, but they handed out individual snack bags and water bottles at the finish (the person doing this had on gloves and a mask). We were on a local running trail and ran around the college here, so I was basically completely by myself the whole time once the faster/slower runners spaced out after the start. There were no in person awards and limited volunteers, they will be picked up at our local running store this week. I thought it was a great way to get us all back out there doing what we love while keeping us safe. All the runners seemed to be very respectful of the rules and everyone left shortly after they finished or remained socially distanced. It made me hopeful for races in the future!

 

[cburnett11]

Running fosters friendships

 

[YawningDodo]

Running achieves milestones
or
Running demands hydration

 

[kbenson13]

running necessitates bathroom-breaks

 

[Grumpy_42K]

Running Twenty Twenty!

Who'da thunk it!?

 

[Karin1984]

So... The Disneyland Paris Half Marathon Weekend in September has been cancelled. I'm a recreational runner, each year for the last 5 years I start my training around April/May for this weekend to do the 36K challenge. I was at 11K last week, running 2 - 3 times a week, with 13 weeks to go I was ahead of schedule. The run is postponed for a full year to September 2021. Any advice what I should do with my training? Scale back training, stop training, push for being able to run a half in September just because that's the tradition, or stick to 10ks?
Any thoughts?

 

[DopeyBadger]

So... The Disneyland Paris Half Marathon Weekend in September has been cancelled. I'm a recreational runner, each year for the last 5 years I start my training around April/May for this weekend to do the 36K challenge. I was at 11K last week, running 2 - 3 times a week, with 13 weeks to go I was ahead of schedule. The run is postponed for a full year to September 2021. Any advice what I should do with my training? Scale back training, stop training, push for being able to run a half in September just because that's the tradition, or stick to 10ks?
Any thoughts?

I think ultimately what you should do moving forward is dictated by your long term goals. What do you want to accomplish in the next month, the next year, the next decade with running? I think that would drive how to approach the training from a stance of stringing together multiple training plans.

 

[Sleepless Knight]

Running challenges you.

Running humbles you.

Running whispers to you that if you can endure this long run, you can endure other more difficult things in your life.

Running teaches you that the "impossible can become possible if you're awesome!!!" as my old friend Rhino the Hamster likes to say.

 

[MommaBerd]

Hi y’all, I need some help/advice. This is really long, so I apologize in advance. I have been running almost a year and had planned to do my first HM back in April. I have been using Jeff Galloway’s runDisney training plans. Back in February, I was at the point that my long run was 12.5 miles. The first 10-ish miles were ok, but I hit a wall. I finished the 12.5, but as I was cooling down, I started to feel faint, my heart and breathing weren’t normal, I felt sick to my stomach, my muscles were really fatigued. Fortunately, I was almost home, but it took me a very long time, with multiple breaks, to make it the last probably 0.3 mile to my house. I was such a mess and was so slow to recover that I decided I should probably go to urgent care. In the back of my mind, I was worried that I had had some kind of cardiac event. And so my husband came and got me and we went. A couple of hours later, several tests, and a bag of IV fluids, they said they didn’t know what had happened, but most likely I had let myself become dehydrated. Ok - note to self: make sure to hydrate day before long run and during it. I thought I had had enough - at least 40 oz of water - but maybe it wasn’t enough. I can’t remember if I had started using Cliff Blocks at this point; part of me thinks yes.

Shortly thereafter, my race was canceled and then quarantine, so I let the plan go, but continued to run three times a week, with a moderately long run (7-8 miles) interspersed. Recently, I decided to start working the plan again, just because...maybe to have a goal?
Anyhow, I worked up to my longer distances again. A couple of weeks ago, I was aiming for 11 miles. Around 10.5, I started feeling weak, decided to cut it short, and began my cool down. By the time I made it home, I was starting to feel the same way I had previously, but fortunately I was home. I feel like I “caught it” just in time - I immediately drank my chocolate milk and refilled my water and added a Nuun. It was really hot and humid that day, but I felt like I had taken it at a slow pace. On my run, I had had 1500 mL of water and a package of Cliff Blocks around the 1 hour mark. It took me about 45 minutes to feel normal, and my muscles were really sore.

Today it happened AGAIN - I was hoping to do 12.5, but only got to 12...and I probably should have stopped and started the cool down sooner. I was fighting off the feeling of passing out (I think my BP drops), my muscles were giving out, and I felt sick. You would have thought I had run a marathon! I am so sore now, too.

I watched my heart rate closely during the entire run; I took it about 1:30-2:00 slower than my normal pace because of the temperature (which actually was not as hot and humid as the previous time); I was hydrated and drank lots of water during my run; I ate the Cliff Blocks; I had a good breakfast. I am frustrated, and I don’t know what I need to do differently. My husband doesn’t really like to hear about these episodes, too. I think he’s starting to get concerned.

Anyone have suggestions? Maybe you have some sage words of advice, @DopeyBadger? Thanks in advance!

 

[Kerry1957]

Hi y’all, I need some help/advice.

I don't have any medical advice as I'm not qualified to give you any. But from personal experience it sounds like you need to modify your refueling and hydration strategy. You may be close to having a serious medical event if you don't get it figured out.

If I understand your comments correctly you drank 1500 mls of water at the 1 hour mark into your run. For me, that is way too much water all at once, way too late into a hot humid run. Perhaps you meant that during the course of the hour you drank that much, and if so, that might be fine. But after running for an hour with no water, the damage may be already done; and then drinking a lot of water at one time may not help much in the short run. You should probably be drinking smaller amounts of water more frequently at intervals that work for you.

@DopeyBadger can probably give you more specifics, but for me, I try not to go over 3 miles in between short, small hydration breaks, two miles if it's nasty hot and humid. I drink water if using a package of GU or a sports drink if not taking GU. I generally don't carry water with me so I often have to leave a full bottle stashed somewhere along my run. For example, today I ran 9 miles at my @DopeyBadger easy pace. I stashed a quart water bottle so that I could hit it at miles 3 and 6. It was a cool day in Chicago this morning so 32 ounces during the run worked well for me. The half liter radler beer when I got home helped too!

I'm also an in-control diabetic so I have to pay attention to my glucose levels as well. Your blood sugar may or may not be too low when these health events happen to you.

I hope at least some of this makes sense to you; running is way too much fun and rewarding to have to be worried about your health every long run. I hope you find a regiment that works for you!

 

[Chasing Dopey]

Hi y’all, I need some help/advice.

I could ask a lot of questions (re: pace, run/walk schedule, HR, all that stuff), but honestly my advice would be to schedule a check-up with your GP, and talk to them. And since your heart and breathing were erratic on that one long run, maybe request a cardiologist to put you through the paces (heart scan, stress test, etc.) I certainly understand your husband's concern. I would want to rule that out and go from there.

 

[RunningGamer]

Hi y’all, I need some help/advice.

Are you drinking just water during these long runs? Drinking water with Nuun? Symptoms combined with your described fueling and hydration regiment sound like electrolyte deficiency.
1.5L is a lot to drink over an hour. Generally you really don't want to drink more than 800mL to 1000mL per hour, even if you are working out in the heat just because that's the general limit of what our bodies can process. Additionally, if you're not also replacing at least some of the electrolytes you're losing through sweat a couple things happen. It's more difficult for your body to retain water (i.e. replace the water you lose through sweat) and it can lead to a disruption of your body's electrical signals for things like the nervous system (e.g. cramps) and the cardiac system (e.g. arrhythmia).

 

[MommaBerd]

Thank you for your responses @Kerry1957 @Chasing Dopey and @RunningGamer! I need to clarify that I drank 1500 mL over the course of my 2 1/2 hour run today, half of that had a Nuun in it. I drink along the way, not all at once. I ate the Cliff Blocks about 1/2 way through the run.

Also as info, my run/walk is 1:05/30 sec and my pace today was right around 12:45.

I know no one can (or should) offer medical advice; I was truly hoping for experiential advice or suggestions for different strategy.

 

[avondale]

Thank you for your responses @Kerry1957 @Chasing Dopey and @RunningGamer! I need to clarify that I drank 1500 mL over the course of my 2 1/2 hour run today, half of that had a Nuun in it. I drink along the way, not all at once. I ate the Cliff Blocks about 1/2 way through the run.

Also as info, my run/walk is 1:05/30 sec and my pace today was right around 12:45.

I know no one can (or should) offer medical advice; I was truly hoping for experiential advice or suggestions for different strategy.

I would agree with some of the others that mention electrolytes. I'd also suggest spreading out your calorie intake more.

For runs about 12 - 13 miles, my long run time would get me done in about your time range. I would also drink about 1.5L of liquid, but I would mix in several hundred calories of Tailwind. Tailwind has both calories and sodium and other electrolytes. I start drinking every 1/2 mile when I get to 1 or 1.5 miles into the run. This spreads out both my hydration and keeps electrolytes coming into my system.

If you eat all the Cliff Blocks in a fairly short period of time, your body may have a hard time digesting them. You may want to try spread them out - and start early, so the calories have time to get into your body for use. Maybe eat a block every 2 miles or something. You may also need more calories overall.

Finally, I'd suggest that you consider whether you had heat exhaustion or heat stroke. Some of the symptoms are roughly similar and of course everyone is a little different. If there's any way that you can try your next long run like this at a time of day when it's cooler or shift it to a good day in the forecast, that might help you test this. Of course, depending on where you live, that may not be possible.

I hope you get this figured out and that nothing is seriously wrong.

 

[DopeyBadger]

Thank you for your responses @Kerry1957 @Chasing Dopey and @RunningGamer! I need to clarify that I drank 1500 mL over the course of my 2 1/2 hour run today, half of that had a Nuun in it. I drink along the way, not all at once. I ate the Cliff Blocks about 1/2 way through the run.

Also as info, my run/walk is 1:05/30 sec and my pace today was right around 12:45.

I know no one can (or should) offer medical advice; I was truly hoping for experiential advice or suggestions for different strategy.

Can you look up what the temp and dew point was during the run on each occasion? I use weather underground for historical weather. Was the change in temperature recent? Have you done at least 10 runs at the same temperature as these stressed runs? It'll help us hone in as to whether 12:45 was slow enough for your current fitness. Additionally, what was a recent Magic Mile, 5k or 10k time?

I concur with others that it very well may be dehydration, heat stress, or electrolyte deficiency. Do you ever feel thirsty? How soon after a normal run and one of these runs do you feel the urge to use the restroom? How much NUUN did you use (mixed per manufacture suggested)? How many cliff blocks packages did you consume?

The total duration of the run was 2.5 hrs. If 750mL NUUN was consumed with normal mixing, and one package of Cliff Blocks was consumed, then you're looking at the following:

750ml NUUN is roughly 1.5 tablets. That's 450mg sodium, 225mg potassium, and 1.5g carbs.
A single cliff blocks package has 100mg sodium, 20mg potassium, and 24g carbs.

TOTAL - 550mg sodium, 245mg potassium, 25.5g carbs. Per hour is 220mg sodium, 98mg potassium, and 10g carbs.

For comparison, I consume on a per hour basis 646mg sodium, 145mg potassium, and 93g carbs (admittedly I'm on the extreme other end of the spectrum).

Do you crave salt when you get home? Do you have practically no appetite at all for hours?

 

[MommaBerd]

I would agree with some of the others that mention electrolytes. I'd also suggest spreading out your calorie intake more.

For runs about 12 - 13 miles, my long run time would get me done in about your time range. I would also drink about 1.5L of liquid, but I would mix in several hundred calories of Tailwind. Tailwind has both calories and sodium and other electrolytes. I start drinking every 1/2 mile when I get to 1 or 1.5 miles into the run. This spreads out both my hydration and keeps electrolytes coming into my system.

If you eat all the Cliff Blocks in a fairly short period of time, your body may have a hard time digesting them. You may want to try spread them out - and start early, so the calories have time to get into your body for use. Maybe eat a block every 2 miles or something. You may also need more calories overall.

Finally, I'd suggest that you consider whether you had heat exhaustion or heat stroke. Some of the symptoms are roughly similar and of course everyone is a little different. If there's any way that you can try your next long run like this at a time of day when it's cooler or shift it to a good day in the forecast, that might help you test this. Of course, depending on where you live, that may not be possible.

I hope you get this figured out and that nothing is seriously wrong.

Thanks for your response, suggestions (I’ll look into Tailwind) and questions. I have typically been consuming the Cliff Blocks in a short period of time - within about 5-8 minutes, and I only have one package, which is 200 calories, IIRC. I don’t think I experienced heat exhaustion, but I guess it’s always a possibility.

 

[MommaBerd]

I am so thankful for *everyone* taking their time to read and respond!

My responses to your questions are in bold below.

Can you look up what the temp and dew point was during the run on each occasion?

The temps will be for the end of my run. The first time was back in March - temp=53°, dew point=52.3
May 30 - T=82°, DP=62.8
June 13 - T=83°, DP=57.33


I use weather underground for historical weather. Was the change in temperature recent? Have you done at least 10 runs at the same temperature as these stressed runs? It'll help us hone in as to whether 12:45 was slow enough for your current fitness.

As I looked back, it surprised me that I have not done more runs at these temps, as it has been consistently in the 80s here. Most of my regular runs have been in the mid-70s

Additionally, what was a recent Magic Mile, 5k or 10k time?

I haven’t run a MM recently, but I have been running 5k’s at a fast pace - usually around 11:00 min/mile with the same run/walk split.

I concur with others that it very well may be dehydration, heat stress, or electrolyte deficiency. Do you ever feel thirsty?
During my runs I do feel thirsty and I drink when I feel thirsty.

How soon after a normal run and one of these runs do you feel the urge to use the restroom?

On a long run, I have to stop for a bathroom break a little less than halfway (there’s a convenient restroom there). I haven’t paid attention to how soon after I get home. Though yesterday, I did happen to notice that I didn’t go for awhile - maybe 45-60 after. I can’t say regarding my normal runs, but probably not long after I get home.

How much NUUN did you use (mixed per manufacture suggested)? How many cliff blocks packages did you consume?


The total duration of the run was 2.5 hrs. If 750mL NUUN was consumed with normal mixing, and one package of Cliff Blocks was consumed, then you're looking at the following:

750ml NUUN is roughly 1.5 tablets. That's 450mg sodium, 225mg potassium, and 1.5g carbs.
A single cliff blocks package has 100mg sodium, 20mg potassium, and 24g carbs.

TOTAL - 550mg sodium, 245mg potassium, 25.5g carbs. Per hour is 220mg sodium, 98mg potassium, and 10g carbs.

For comparison, I consume on a per hour basis 646mg sodium, 145mg potassium, and 93g carbs (admittedly I'm on the extreme other end of the spectrum).

Do you crave salt when you get home? Do you have practically no appetite at all for hours?

I don’t crave salt when I get home, but I definitely crave salty things in general more than I used to. After this long run, I had to force myself to drink my chocolate milk (I read that is a good recovery drink, right?) because I was sick to my stomach, and I did have to make myself eat. Same back in March. After the run in May (10.7 mi), I don’t remember having to force myself to drink the chocolate milk. But that “episode” wasn’t as bad as the one in March (12.5 mi) and yesterday (12.2 mi).