This is how we our country is perceived...

[trompettecon]

https://www.cnn.com/2023/08/31/americas/canada-lgbtq-us-travel-advisory/index.html

 

[Notreallyaustralian]

And the reputation is very deserved.

 

[tink2424]

Propaganda... Nothing more.

 

[starlite_]

Propaganda... Nothing more.

I'm sure Canada is actively lying to smear USA reputation.

 

[tink2424]

I'm sure Canada is actively lying to smear USA reputation.

It is based on activist group declaring a national state of emergency. Tell me where have people actually been denied care (I mean adults not children going through gender re-assignment). This is all propaganda by activists when nothing has actually happened to anyone.

Neither the statement nor the travel advisory single out specific states or laws.

The updated travel advice comes after US-based advocacy group Human Rights Campaign declared a national state of emergency for LGBTQ people in June.

 

[starlite_]

It is based on activist group declaring a national state of emergency. Tell me where have people actually been denied care (I mean adults not children going through gender re-assignment). This is all propaganda by activists when nothing has actually happened to anyone.

Neither the statement nor the travel advisory single out specific states or laws.

The updated travel advice comes after US-based advocacy group Human Rights Campaign declared a national state of emergency for LGBTQ people in June.

It's 100% a conspiracy and a smear campaign . That Canada just wants all the LGBT+ tourist money.

After all, it's not like there are a lot of published stories of LGBT+ having horrible experiences in the USA for various reasons. If there were, I'm sure you could google them and not need me to provide them.

 

[tink2424]

It's 100% a conspiracy and a smear campaign . That Canada just wants all the LGBT+ tourist money.

After all, it's not like there are a lot of published stories of LGBT+ having horrible experiences in the USA for various reasons. If there were, I'm sure you could google them and not need me to provide them.

Ok, then provide them. Stories directly related to harm due to these laws.

 

[bsmcneil]

Ok, then provide them. Stories directly related to harm due to these laws.

Pulse shooting happens - a terroristic action that creates fear for folks who are LGBTQ+
Laws enacted to disallow people from talking about LGBTQ+ people or issues
... Are you really suggesting that there needs to be another action like Pulse for it to be an emergency? Sometimes emergencies are named as such when conditions make it clear that things are unsafe (for instance a hurricane) even if it hasn't made landfall yet. The point is to be careful so that no one does get hurt - not that we should wait until it happens and then say something.

 

[Notreallyaustralian]

Pulse shooting happens - a terroristic action that creates fear for folks who are LGBTQ+
Laws enacted to disallow people from talking about LGBTQ+ people or issues
... Are you really suggesting that there needs to be another action like Pulse for it to be an emergency? Sometimes emergencies are named as such when conditions make it clear that things are unsafe (for instance a hurricane) even if it hasn't made landfall yet. The point is to be careful so that no one does get hurt - not that we should wait until it happens and then say something.

Yes. It's like the Holocaust didn't happen until the bodies were found at the death camps. Before that, everything was safe and wonderful for Jews, LGBTQ+, Roma people, disabled people, etc.

 

[bsmcneil]

Shootings can happen anywhere and are certainly not related to law changes. And that is not the focus of these alerts. They are about the laws. So what law changed that allows shootings like Pulse nightclub?

I am suggesting that someone is harmed from the laws that were enacted. I haven't heard of one person being denied care for something life threatening. Or that they can't find any doctor in Florida that will treat them for being LGBTQ+.. So no I don't believe any of this is real as there hasn't been 1 person harmed from the laws.

How is this related to the Holocaust? Who is being exterminated and where in the US. I'll wait...

Yeah, my guess is that if you did hear a story, you'd move the goalposts to further your own narrative. I have a kid (we're in Indiana) who is scared by both the Florida law and its similar counterpart in Indiana. It hurts their esteem and it is difficult to find appropriate providers. But hey - to you, anything you disagree with is propaganda. For what it's worth, no one should have to prove to you, a random internet person, that a minor in their care isn't getting sufficient medical coverage. So, good luck on the ignore list! Have a magical day!

 

[Minnie1222]

The point still stands. Nothing has been reported that has happened as a consequence of these laws. Therefore at this point these "travel advisories" are propaganda. Come back to me when you have actual evidence.

The main purpose of an advisory is to prevent a tragedy from happening.

 

[RedHead0186]

You can be scared for a lot of reasons and none of the reasons have to be logical.

The point still stands. Nothing has been reported that has happened as a consequence of these laws. Therefore at this point these "travel advisories" are propaganda. Come back to me when you have actual evidence.

Thanks & you have a magical day as well!

So you want to wait until something bad happens to someone before you'll believe that these laws can be harmful?

Not specifically related to these laws, but a good example of recent laws that have hurt people. States putting their own abortion laws into place after Roe v. Wade was overturned has been harmful. Physicians in some states were advised by legal teams not to treat women who were miscarrying because of the fear of litigation if they helped these women and then were found to be outside the law. A lot of it was because the laws were written so ambiguously that the lawyers were trying to 'untangle' what was allowed and what wasn't. In the meantime, patients (mothers and babies) suffered.

And I'm not basing it off of "propaganda." I work in healthcare and heard real life stories of these things happening. So that's one very recent example of how laws related to healthcare can have negative consequences. So I can understand why people would be scared in this situation.

 

[Lord Manhammer]

It seems clear that this "tink" person has their head in the sand. But I'd suggest changing the tenor of this thread as it seems to be veering dangerously close to the political and could be nixed by the mods.

 

[bsmcneil]

For those interested, here's an article about actual people dealing with actual effects (that was on the home page of Slate - I didn't even go looking for it).

https://slate.com/technology/2023/0...ida-prescription-telehealth-testosterone.html

 

[john7994]

It seems clear that this "tink" person has their head in the sand. But I'd suggest changing the tenor of this thread as it seems to be veering dangerously close to the political and could be nixed by the mods.

Nah they really don’t have their head in the sand - they are on this thread for a reason … and the resulting discourse will be why this thread will eventually get shutdown

 

[Lord Manhammer]

Nah they really don’t have their head in the sand - they are on this thread for a reason … and the resulting discourse will be why this thread will eventually get shutdown

Yeeeahhhh, and I know that reason all too well. *sigh* You are quite correct.

 

[TeamRiley]

Just a heads up. Has anyone actually read the real document published by Canada? Not just the CNN article? It is not a 'travel advisory', it is titled "United States Travel Advice".

I suggest you all (on both sides of this moronic exchange) do so before freaking out. The statement is not in the "Risk Level" section, or the "Safety and Security" section. It is in the "Laws and Culture" section along with 'Cannabis', 'Perscription Medication','Dual Citizenship', and 'Driving'.

This is the sum total of what is mentioned about 2SLGBTQI+ travellers:

2SLGBTQI+ travellers
Some states have enacted laws and policies that may affect 2SLGBTQI+ persons. Check relevant state and local laws.

If the media didn't always have an agenda, and if Americans were not always so stupid as to get all worked up without ever doing a bit of fact checking and studying, these kinds of ridiculous arguments would never happen.

 

[john7994]

Just a heads up. Has anyone actually read the real document published by Canada? Not just the CNN article? It is not a 'travel advisory', it is titled "United States Travel Advice".

I suggest you all (on both sides of this moronic exchange) do so before freaking out. The statement is not in the "Risk Level" section, or the "Safety and Security" section. It is in the "Laws and Culture" section along with 'Cannabis', 'Perscription Medication','Dual Citizenship', and 'Driving'.

This is the sum total of what is mentioned about 2SLGBTQI+ travellers:

2SLGBTQI+ travellers
Some states have enacted laws and policies that may affect 2SLGBTQI+ persons. Check relevant state and local laws.

If the media didn't always have an agenda, and if Americans were not always so stupid as to get all worked up without ever doing a bit of fact checking and studying, these kinds of ridiculous arguments would never happen.

And to that end, let’s stop blaming the “media” for everything least of all for having an “agenda” - that’s an old and tired excuse already - everyone has an agenda of what’s “important” to them which feeds the respective business models to grab audience eyeballs and advertising of what passes for modern media these days.

In this case, the “travel advice” is what it is - one group feels it’s necessary to call out, another group doesn’t think it should be called out or garner any attention, and a third group is completely indifferent. So how is that different from any other “major issue” on this planet right now?

So when I see this argument, where the “media” is concerned, is the suggestion that only one side should have a say? Otherwise, maybe we should be focusing on the issues themselves which precipitate the media coverage and not the coverage itself.

 

[TeamRiley]

So when I see this argument, where the “media” is concerned, is the suggestion that only one side should have a say? Otherwise, maybe we should be focusing on the issues themselves which precipitate the media coverage and not the coverage itself.

Your argument is flawed. The CNN article made it an issue when none existed.

The Canadian document is a guide reminding travelers what they should remember to consider when visiting the US.

The CNN article exagerated the publication to portray it as a warning to the LGBTQ community not to come to the States.

 

[Disneychick13]

And to that end, let’s stop blaming the “media” for everything least of all for having an “agenda” - that’s an old and tired excuse already - everyone has an agenda of what’s “important” to them which feeds the respective business models to grab audience eyeballs and advertising of what passes for modern media these days.

In this case, the “travel advice” is what it is - one group feels it’s necessary to call out, another group doesn’t think it should be called out or garner any attention, and a third group is completely indifferent. So how is that different from any other “major issue” on this planet right now?

So when I see this argument, where the “media” is concerned, is the suggestion that only one side should have a say? Otherwise, maybe we should be focusing on the issues themselves which precipitate the media coverage and not the coverage itself.

Let’s stop blaming the media for having an agenda? The media is who is supposed to be unbiased. To portray an accurate rendering of news and information. When a “news” outlet writes a story that is meant to inflame Instead of inform, the rubicon has been crossed. Shameful is what it is. That article was nothing more than propaganda. We should blame the media. Because they are to blame. And shame on all of us for believing what they spew.