What is going on with Disney parks?

[Mome Rath]

Not completely. I think you could say the opposite for something like Pandora. Many were like why and this is gonna suck and now it’s one of the most popular things at WDW.

I left that out because so many people did totally dismiss (or actually hate on) Pandora and Avatar, whilst I was fan-girling all over it from the moment it was announced! lol So, to me, that was a Disney surprise to the upside due to the attitude against it, which I'm not quite sure they planned for...

 

[Searc]

I'll fully admit I personally am in a "disney funk" at the moment, but there were times on the last trip that i was thinking..."we paid how much for this?". When i started having those thoughts, its when its time to pack it in. The value is gone. At least to me.

I am in the same funk as you. This last trip was with my DH, who does not love Disney like I do and he only goes every few years to make me happy (and I love him for that!). Seeing current prices through his eyes was quite the reality check for me. I've said this before, but yes, we can easily afford the prices at Disney. That doesn't mean I feel there is much value left in vacationing there. If I feel like I'm getting ripped off the entire vacation (see my $18 lemoncello referred to above), how is that enjoyable?

 

[jkohmi]

In the moment, it didn't ruin our day...just y'know, one more little frustration.

Yes. This exactly. This is how I feel about so much of what's going on. Parking fees? Won't ruin my day, but they're frustrating. Earlier closing times because of hard ticket events? Won't ruin my day, but they're frustrating. Cutting a little street entertainment? Won't ruin my day, but it's frustrating. Planning for date-based tickets? Won't ruin my day, but it's frustrating. Planning a PPO breakfast 180 days in advance and then finding out it's no longer PPO? Won't ruin my day, but it's frustrating. MDE glitches on FP+ day and I miss that SDD FP+? Won't ruin my day, but it's frustrating. Cutting a little more street entertainment? Won't ruin my day, but.................at some point, none of my days have been ruined, but I start noticing that there are an awful lot of little frustrations adding up here, and I'm paying an awful lot of money for them.

Having said that, as long as the bulk of my frustrations take place during the planning process and not while I'm actually there, I might complain but will probably not change my vacation habits TOO much. WDW is my happy place because once all the planning is done, I can just show up and not have to think about anything. But decreasing park hours (due to hard ticket events or otherwise), paying for parking, cutting streetmosphere-type things...those are frustrations that don't just frustrate me from a distance 60-180 days in advance that I can forget about once I enter the bubble. Those are frustrations that I feel while I'm there, too.

 

[Searc]

Rapid large increases haven't helped, though. That last AP increase...I was an out-of-state AP, and having the AP meant taking more trips. I GOT the AP, though, because we could easily break even on 2 trips, so we spaced our yearly trips for just shy of a year apart. Then, since I already had the AP, random cheap flights were enough to convince me to book another trip. Now I think the break-even point is too high. I won't actively plan more than 2 trips per year, so if the break-even point requires more than that, I won't get the AP...even though if I did get the AP, I can almost guarantee I'd sneak in at least one extra trip just because there was a flight sale or something.

I was an out of state AP holder who bought when it was around $900 with taxes. My AP expired a couple weeks ago and I did not renew, which made me sad. The new AP price is ridiculous.

 

[YesterDark]

There are a few points that were brought up here and in other threads over the years that are valid:

1. Cost
2. "Complex Planning"
3. Erosion of benefits

It's essentially those three things. Cost is something that is getting out of control. I'm planning another trip in march and that's only because I want to go one more time before my youngest of three kids turns 3. Then the vacation gets extremely expensive. Damn tickets cost a fortune.

The complexity is something I struggle with. I enjoy the planning process and while I understand the stress of picking a restaurant out 180 days in advance, it's not that big of a deal. You can always change it. I think people make too big a deal out of it. And for those that complain about doing planning at all, well that's just silly. If you wanted to do a European vacation, there is still alot of planning you have to do.

Erosion of benefits is something that is definitely seen. Nickle and diming, getting more expensive at the same time. It turns people off.

The Disney vacation is forcing families to go shorter durations or not at all.

Disney is big business and big business typically takes forever to shift strategies on pricing etc. I wouldn't be surprised if we saw some steep-ish discounts for next year if they seen light bookings. No clue how soft they are for next year if at all.

 

[Searc]

Not completely. I think you could say the opposite for something like Pandora. Many were like why and this is gonna suck and now it’s one of the most popular things at WDW.

Meh. I'm not impressed with it and have thought ever since it was announced it was a terrible fit for WDW. My feelings haven't changed.

 

[Searc]

There are a few points that were brought up here and in other threads over the years that are valid:

1. Cost
2. "Complex Planning"
3. Erosion of benefits

It's essentially those three things. Cost is something that is getting out of control. I'm planning another trip in march and that's only because I want to go one more time before my youngest of three kids turns 3. Then the vacation gets extremely expensive. Damn tickets cost a fortune.

The complexity is something I struggle with. I enjoy the planning process and while I understand the stress of picking a restaurant out 180 days in advance, it's not that big of a deal. You can always change it. I think people make too big a deal out of it. And for those that complain about doing planning at all, well that's just silly. If you wanted to do a European vacation, there is still alot of planning you have to do.

Erosion of benefits is something that is definitely seen. Nickle and diming, getting more expensive at the same time. It turns people off.

The Disney vacation is forcing families to go shorter durations or not at all.

Disney is big business and big business typically takes forever to shift strategies on pricing etc. I wouldn't be surprised if we saw some steep-ish discounts for next year if they seen light bookings. No clue how soft they are for next year if at all.

For me, while the complexity of visiting is somewhat frustrating, I've been grandfathered into it, if you will. I've kept up with changes and am familiar with how all the different systems work at WDW. A first time visitor would be totally overwhelmed with all the moving pieces of planning a vacation there. I say often I can't imagine how hard it would be to plan visiting WDW today. I'd give up 30 minutes in and say we're going somewhere else!

 

[rteetz]

Meh. I'm not impressed with it and have thought ever since it was announced it was a terrible fit for WDW. My feelings haven't changed.

Myself and I think many others would strongly disagree with you. I even wrote an article for the Dis on how well it fits with the way it was built.

 

[dez1978]

For me, while the complexity of visiting is somewhat frustrating, I've been grandfathered into it, if you will. I've kept up with changes and am familiar with how all the different systems work at WDW. A first time visitor would be totally overwhelmed with all the moving pieces of planning a vacation there. I say often I can't imagine how hard it would be to plan visiting WDW today. I'd give up 30 minutes in and say we're going somewhere else!

we went for the 1st time in May. It was pretty overwhelming, even with a TA. We have 2 boys 5&8 and not knowing how they were going to do, and hearing all about the need for a good plan so you didn't wait in line, I may have over done it, idk. But it was horribly hot when we went, like 105 heat index, while at home it was 70. So none of us did well. We are going to try again in Jan, hoping the cooler weather will help, and having an idea of what to expect. But Idk if we really felt the magic. Hoping to this next time.

 

[sethschroeder]

What drives me nuts is that they are caring about attendance numbers instead of actual profit. Unless I missed something they are still making more money than ever.

I have zero issues with higher prices just give me a trade off of lower crowds.

 

[Artax]

This thread hits really close to home for me. We have been visiting wdw pretty regularly at least once a year since my older 2 kids were 1 and 3 (now 9 and 11). So I am starting to hit the child adult stage with my 2 older children and now on top of that my youngest just turned 3. I have been starting to research and plan our trip for next summer and I am honestly having sticker shock. On top of adult tickets and food for 10 and 12 year olds, I am now required to get a minimum of a moderate room with 5th sleeper along with added tickets for my 3 yr old. And on top of all these things are huge price increases, and date based tickets, etc. My trips have basically almost doubled in price in just over a year. I understand some of these are because of the makeup of my family, but its just starting to be a bit much. My wife has been saying it for a few years that things are getting too expensive and we should maybe think about doing something else and I have always been the apologist in our house, using family time away from work as an excuse. I am starting to feel my excuse inst working even on myself anymore.

On top of all these mixed emotions I am having, we finally, after many years talked my wifes sisters family in to joining us next summer. And with everything going on I am really starting to regret it and I am honestly not looking forward to it as I can already here her sister complaining about how expensive everything is.

One last point I want to make is this forum in general. I used to love to come to the disboards between trips and read the parks and strategies board and this rumors and news board. But lately even that doesnt seem to be enjoyable, with half the posts on the latest "news" being negative from a park goers perspective. How do you get excited for a super expensive trip when all you read about on your beloved information site is about price increases, and entertainment cuts, cast member cuts, etc. Its just depressing.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I have zero issues with higher prices just give me a trade off of lower crowds.

Except that just isn't how it's working at least not how they want it to work.

All summer, news sources all over the place have been giving such negative press on the low crowds at DLR and now all we're starting to hear about it shifts in leadership and cutbacks.

You just really can't raise the pricing to lower the crowds because you'll end up with a net negative effect. People here and there willing to pay won't make up for everything else that comes with it.

And as you see the vast majority of the people cite cost as a main contributing factor.

 

[YesterDark]

For me, while the complexity of visiting is somewhat frustrating, I've been grandfathered into it, if you will. I've kept up with changes and am familiar with how all the different systems work at WDW. A first time visitor would be totally overwhelmed with all the moving pieces of planning a vacation there. I say often I can't imagine how hard it would be to plan visiting WDW today. I'd give up 30 minutes in and say we're going somewhere else!

I've been on 3 adult trips in my life 2015, 2017 and 2019. My sister planned the 2015 trip and I just showed up. 2017 I planned the whole thing and it was relatively easy to do and my only help was google.

I said this somewhere else on the boards, if you're spending 5-7 thousand dollars on a trip, then you better do at least a few google searches about it.

edit to add:

A lot of people get overwhelmed because they worry too much about missing something. I get that. But that's a different issue.

 

[Unvoiced_Apollo]

Having said that, as long as the bulk of my frustrations take place during the planning process and not while I'm actually there, I might complain but will probably not change my vacation habits TOO much. WDW is my happy place because once all the planning is done, I can just show up and not have to think about anything. But decreasing park hours (due to hard ticket events or otherwise), paying for parking, cutting streetmosphere-type things...those are frustrations that don't just frustrate me from a distance 60-180 days in advance that I can forget about once I enter the bubble. Those are frustrations that I feel while I'm there, too.

And here's the thing. I really don't mind planning around those hard ticket events. I'll other get them and participate or I won't and I'll still have plenty to do the other days. I can deal with parking fees. I can deal with price increases. What I personally can't stand is that we as park goers are not seeing any value with those increases. Those After Hours and other hard ticket events should be bonuses. Something that's special to those that buy them but not a necessity to the rest of the guests who. But when everything else is being cut, there's nothing to help buoy that Disney experience above other theme parks.

 

[sethschroeder]

Except that just isn't how it's working at least not how they want it to work.

Oh I know that's not how they want it to work.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

we went for the 1st time in May. It was pretty overwhelming, even with a TA. We have 2 boys 5&8 and not knowing how they were going to do, and hearing all about the need for a good plan so you didn't wait in line, I may have over done it, idk. But it was horribly hot when we went, like 105 heat index, while at home it was 70. So none of us did well. We are going to try again in Jan, hoping the cooler weather will help, and having an idea of what to expect. But Idk if we really felt the magic. Hoping to this next time.

Weather can have such an impact on people truly. We get heat, we get humidity (though this summer has been quite mild) where I live in the midwest but even people in FL will say it's not that they are out there in the theme parks pushing hard like a lot of tourists do because well..that's why they are there.

Even the best of us adults have our cranky, I just don't want to do anything anymore days while there

 

[DGsAtBLT]

For me, while the complexity of visiting is somewhat frustrating, I've been grandfathered into it, if you will. I've kept up with changes and am familiar with how all the different systems work at WDW. A first time visitor would be totally overwhelmed with all the moving pieces of planning a vacation there. I say often I can't imagine how hard it would be to plan visiting WDW today. I'd give up 30 minutes in and say we're going somewhere else!

All of that!

And also someone like you or I is not going to be shocked by most if any changes or closures upon arrival. Most of us who care enough to post here likely keep up with every mundane piece of news coming out of WDW, especially when an upcoming trip is booked.

I think a lot of Disney people really take for granted how much head space we give WDW and how much were helped by all our prior knowledge and experience.

 

[Rusty2rules]

I've got to chime in here. I'm not one of these go-every-year folks or an AP holder. Every other year...maybe. Disney is a treat for us. With that said, I've pretty much reached that breaking point. I'm going in 2020 for one reason and one reason only. SWGE. I'm waiting that long because ROTR isn't open yet (from the reports I'm reading, at this point I'm hoping it's open by then!). Some people are complaining about the amount of planning that goes into a Disney vacation. I get that. It's not for everybody. I actually enjoy the planning. I do miss the old same-day FPs though.

I saw something in this thread about millennials being raised on Harry Potter and not Star Wars. I'm 57 (will be 58 when we go next year) and my son is 25 (will be 26). I love Star Wars! And I've loved the new movies, too, I don't care what anyone says. I also love the HP series! Read the books and saw the movies. Yes, my son loved HP, that's what he grew up on. Then I introduced him to Star Wars. Now he's in to that as well. It doesn't have to be one or the other.

I've seen people mention they're switching to Universal. I'd LOVE to see Harry Potter Land! But in order to see the whole thing you have to have tickets to both parks (money grab). For my wife, son, and I to properly do HPL, if the pricing I've seen is correct, it would be over $600. I can do a whole lotta Disney for $600.

With all of that said, next year will probably be my last trip. We went in 2017. The only reason that wasn't my last trip is SWGE. Why?

• Charging for parking at the resorts? Really? C'mon. That's ridiculous.
• I expect to pay more for food and drinks at any amusement park. But $9 for "milk" at SWGE? $18 for a lemoncello? Really? Seriously? C'mon.
• The shutting down of shows can't be justified.
• Photo boxes instead of real photographers? Replacing trained, excellent photographers? Really? Seriously? This one really grinds me. IMO, that's inexcusable.
• EPCOT has needed rehab for YEARS. I mean YEARS. I'm stunned when people say that's their favorite park. It's easily, far and away my least favorite park. The rehab they're finally doing is 15-20 years overdue. With the amount of money Disney makes, to allow that park to become so out of date is inexcusable. Then, when they did do an update on Soarin', they screwed it up! Ugh. BTW, on a separate note, I was really surprised to see that Mission:Space wasn't lined up for the wrecking ball when the park rehab plans came out (unless I missed it).
• Overall cost. People have always told me "a Disney vacation is so expensive!" My response has always been if you're going to Disney for four days, take that cost and compare it to a four-day vacation in New York. I feel like the scale has tipped in the New York vacation direction.
• Then, not only is the cost of my vacation going up, but the operating hours of the parks are getting shorter! Doesn't that seem backwards to you?
• The costs of the dessert parties have skyrocketed! It's ridiculous.

If I could sit down with the Disney head honchos, I would ask them to lower their ticket prices - some, not a lot, offer better room discounts, especially in off season, get rid of the parking fee for resorts (ridiculous!), cut the specialty event prices (after hour parties, dessert parties, etc.) in half, get rid of those awful photo boxes, reduce some of the food pricing, and extend park hours.

I've heard the theory that they were increasing their prices as a form of crowd control. I think they've over reached now. They're greed is biting them in the rear end.

Like I said, 2020 will probably be my last trip. That truly makes me sad. I've always enjoyed my trips to Disney. It's not because I'm afraid of the economy tanking, or a recession, or anything like that. I simply can't justify the cost anymore.

 

[YesterDark]

All of that!

And also someone like you or I is not going to be shocked by most if any changes or closures upon arrival. Most of us who care enough to post here likely keep up with every mundane piece of news coming out of WDW, especially when an upcoming trip is booked.

I think a lot of Disney people really take for granted how much head space we give WDW and how much were helped by all our prior knowledge and experience.

The mindshare we all give Disney is a huge factor. It's a good point.

Still, I think a lot of people just get lazy or overwhelmed and give up after a cursory glance at what you have to do.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

How do you get excited for a super expensive trip when all you read about on your beloved information site is about price increases, and entertainment cuts, cast member cuts, etc. Its just depressing.

I know how you feel but on the flipside when we went to WDW back in 2017 we bought the tickets at the 2015 prices in 2016 from Undercover Tourist specifically because The DIS gave us the heads up that ticket pricing was about to raise and even though Undercover Tourist did too The DIS had more specific information on just when.

Now I don't like to think about the other stuff either just pointing out that if can be helpful at times even if those times are few and far between when you're talking about exactly what I quoted above.