Covid 19 WBPC cruise

[_auroraborealis_]

They didn't have tests, so saying they were free of cases is worth exactly nothing.

 

[mab2012]

They didn't have tests, so saying they were free of cases is worth exactly nothing.

Not sure I follow. Was that a response to my post? I said that the ship was thought to be free of cases at the time of debarkation, not that it was actually clear. And that comment was in response to someone wanting to know if DCL knowingly dismissed symptoms or withheld information from passengers while onboard. I don't believe that to be the case.

 

[_auroraborealis_]

Not sure I follow. Was that a response to my post? I said that the ship was thought to be free of cases at the time of debarkation, not that it was actually clear. And that comment was in response to someone wanting to know if DCL knowingly dismissed symptoms or withheld information from passengers while onboard. I don't believe that to be the case.

It was more general. The Wonder was claiming "no cases" along the way, but, anywhere, anyone who is claiming "no cases" without tests is just making it up. Asymptomatic and low-symptom cases can easily be overlooked without testing, and claiming "no cases" with "no tests" is a false confidence.

 

[MomOTwins]

It was more general. The Wonder was claiming "no cases" along the way, but, anywhere, anyone who is claiming "no cases" without tests is just making it up. Asymptomatic and low-symptom cases can easily be overlooked without testing, and claiming "no cases" with "no tests" is a false confidence.

It was known and reported at the time of disembarkation that one crew member was thought to have influenza. So it wasn't 100% all clear.

 

[mab2012]

It was more general. The Wonder was claiming "no cases" along the way, but, anywhere, anyone who is claiming "no cases" without tests is just making it up. Asymptomatic and low-symptom cases can easily be overlooked without testing, and claiming "no cases" with "no tests" is a false confidence.

I'm not sure DCL ever directly claimed "no cases". Not that I recall, anyway. What they said was that nobody had reported symptoms as of the time of debarkation. Others, including passengers, may have translated that to "no cases".

Agreed that "no known cases" would have been more accurate. Although in fairness, we're viewing what happened then through the lens of what we know now, and our collective understanding of this virus has evolved quite a lot over the past 2-3 weeks. At the time, most people assumed that if there were cases onboard, we would have seen symptoms sooner. Actually I think what happened on the Wonder is kind of an interesting illustration of just how sneaky and insidious this virus can be.

 

[o&smom]

Very interesting. Didn’t the captain say they had no reported cases in the announcements?

YES! Repeatedly we were told no flulike symptoms onboard. How could they not have warned us of that someone showed symptoms if they had reported to CDC. Again, repeatedly told no flu symptoms reported on board.

 

[o&smom]

They didn't have tests, so saying they were free of cases is worth exactly nothing.

We were not told we were free of cases. The captain repeatedly told us that no one had reported ANY symptoms.

 

[o&smom]

It was known and reported at the time of disembarkation that one crew member was thought to have influenza. So it wasn't 100% all clear.

Was that on Friday? We disembarked on Thurs and the last announcement we heard from the captain was still no one reporting any symptoms.

 

[Naeher]

@o&smom @MomOTwins hope you're all healthy?

 

[o&smom]

@o&smom @MomOTwins hope you're all healthy?

Thank you! Doing very well. Still no typical symptoms.

 

[monkeydawn]

We were not told we were free of cases. The captain repeatedly told us that no one had reported ANY symptoms.

I dont get this (seen the same reported for other ships too). Ive yet to be on a cruise where someone wasnt displaying symptoms. There is always someone coughing. I assume based on the rate I or someone in my party has caught a minor cold that there were people on board with fevers as well. So there must be some other diagnostic that was being used.

 

[Jen_K]

I was on the WBPC cruise and I know for a fact that people were coughing throughout the cruise. We had an older woman a few tables away from us at dinner that hacked away for several nights. It was loud and repetitive and that's why it caught our attention. I'm willing to bet though that there were people that had symptoms but didn't report them because they didn't want to be quarantined. We'll never know for sure. I will say that my family has been fine since debarking on the 19th and none of us have had any symptoms. I'll be taking the antibody test for sure though once it is available.

 

[TestingH2O]

I assume based on the rate I or someone in my party has caught a minor cold that there were people on board with fevers as well. So there must be some other diagnostic that was being used.

On previous cruises, have you gone to the medical center for this? If no, then the ship would also indicate that you were not displaying symptoms. At the time of sailing, symptomatic presentation still included high fever. Now, three weeks later, we know that’s not always true. However, at the time of sailing and at the time the ship indicated that symptoms weren’t presenting, that was the medical knowledge available therefore just a cough wasn't enough to cause major concern. The captain and medical staff can only know what they are told. If a passenger doesn’t tell them they are ill, then the captain doesn’t know.

 

[Dug720]

On previous cruises, have you gone to the medical center for this? If no, then the ship would also indicate that you were not displaying symptoms. At the time of sailing, symptomatic presentation still included high fever. Now, three weeks later, we know that’s not always true. However, at the time of sailing and at the time the ship indicated that symptoms weren’t presenting, that was the medical knowledge available therefore just a cough wasn't enough to cause major concern. The captain and medical staff can only know what they are told. If a passenger doesn’t tell them they are ill, then the captain doesn’t know.

This exactly. They are not recording every sniffle, sneeze, cough, etc. They rely on people who ARE feeling ill to go to Medical so that they can be checked and cleared or quarantined. Most people do not want to risk getting quarantined and so will avoid going to Medical at all costs, thus causing things to spread more easily.

This is gross, but even if someone is not throwing up in public areas or bathrooms but only in the privacy of their cabin's bathroom, no one is going to know unless they report to Medical. Heck, a couple of years ago I was on the Wonder over my Feb break, and the night we ate in Tiana's Palace, one of the kids at the table next to the one where my sister and I were threw up at the table (Mom managed to catch most in the bread basket). They left to go to their cabin and clean up, the mother and daughter at the table with them were immediately relocated to another table, my sister and I were offered but opted to stay put as nothing had spewed our direction, and housekeeping was immediately there, bagging every single thing at the table - plates, silverware, napkins...everything - to take to the incinerator. My sister called one of her colleagues to report the table number so that their cabin could be flagged until cleared as the kid would not be allowed in the kids' clubs until he had been free of it for 24 hours - she just had a gut feeling. Sure enough, she found out the next day that the mom had tried to check him into the club the next morning but he was flagged and then they HAD to report to medical, which they had not done.

So yes, there are plenty of selfish people who only think about themselves and their fun and will avoid going to get checked out when they are sick unless they absolutely have to. Though as we all know by now (if we didn't before), you can be completely asymptomatic and spread this, so it might not have even been someone coughing or sneezing who was the carrier.

 

[monkeydawn]

While I understand the point that if no one has reported to medical then they can choose to say no symptoms aboard. But medical doesnt exist in a vacuum, staff and officers are mingling with the passengers and I am sure coughs were heard. And wouldnt it have been wonderful if they had been just a little proactive and had them mingling a little extra with the passengers to be on the lookout for symptomatic passengers.

@Dug720 It's not that I dont believe you but I just find it unbelievable that the waitstaff didnt report that family. Its not like there is open seating, they know who it was.

 

[MomOTwins]

@o&smom @MomOTwins hope you're all healthy?

Doing much better, thanks!

It's not that I dont believe you but I just find it unbelievable that the waitstaff didnt report that family. Its not like there is open seating, they know who it was.

Maybe they did and it was flagged in the system both by Dug720's sister and by the waitstaff. But also... they do work for tips so I can see them not wanting to anger a guest, no matter how unreasonable the guest is being.

 

[Dug720]

It's not that I dont believe you but I just find it unbelievable that the waitstaff didnt report that family. Its not like there is open seating, they know who it was.

Doing much better, thanks!



Maybe they did and it was flagged in the system both by Dug720's sister and by the waitstaff. But also... they do work for tips so I can see them not wanting to anger a guest, no matter how unreasonable the guest is being.

They likely were reported by the head server. BUT my sister was reporting it as a back-up just in case.

But medical doesnt exist in a vacuum, staff and officers are mingling with the passengers and I am sure coughs were heard. And wouldnt it have been wonderful if they had been just a little proactive and had them mingling a little extra with the passengers to be on the lookout for symptomatic passengers.

And we are in allergy season and many of the symptoms are similar. People can be asthmatic and cough. Coughing is not a telltale sign. Even if they were "mingling" what is to stop someone from saying it is allergies? There are no fully universal symptoms of this - I know people who have had fever for days (they were presumptive as they were not able to be tested) and others who were tested and had no fever, so that's not a foolproof thing. Until there is a rapid test and everyone's freedom is given up and medical is cramming things up everyone's nose, we sadly have to rely on people being honest.

 

[AquaDame]

@Dug720 It's not that I dont believe you but I just find it unbelievable that the waitstaff didnt report that family. Its not like there is open seating, they know who it was.

I never knew they were supposed to..? I was VERY sick a couple of years ago on a cruise (felt perfectly fine for the first few days but started getting sick during) and trust me, the staff all knew I wasn't feeling well. My host had a harder time getting in to the stateroom to clean as I just wanted to sleep and keep my cough to myself, the waitstaff was bringing me bland food and plain vanilla ice cream, heck the concierge hosts gave me their own stash of theraflu. Not one of them reported me. I did end up going to the infirmary when I developed conjunctivitis on top of my bad cold and they werent interested at all in any of my syptoms aside from my eyes which I had gone down there for.

Obviously I assume this has now changed and they'll be more quick to assist the ill.

 

[MomOTwins]

I never knew they were supposed to..? I was VERY sick a couple of years ago on a cruise (felt perfectly fine for the first few days but started getting sick during) and trust me, the staff all knew I wasn't feeling well. My host had a harder time getting in to the stateroom to clean as I just wanted to sleep and keep my cough to myself, the waitstaff was bringing me bland food and plain vanilla ice cream, heck the concierge hosts gave me their own stash of theraflu. Not one of them reported me. I did end up going to the infirmary when I developed conjunctivitis on top of my bad cold and they werent interested at all in any of my syptoms aside from my eyes which I had gone down there for.

Obviously I assume this has now changed and they'll be more quick to assist the ill.

Hmm, maybe they gave you a "pass" because of concierge? Or maybe they are a bit stricter when kids' club is involved. I know that when my coworker cruised last year (before all this), her child came down with a bug mid-cruise and the kids club staff noticed they were a bit droopy and took their temperature, and because of the fever, they were quarantined for the rest of the cruise. So they did enforce this at least some times, because that was April 2019 before anything covid-related.

My DH was also quarantined when he got sick, although we called the medical center right away as soon as he fell ill. The instructions in the navigator are pretty broad--they just say to contact the health center "should anyone in party become ill." But we are lawyers so probably a bit more "rules oriented" than some. My guess is that the average person doesn't even read the "IMPORTANT INFORMATION" section in the navigator, much less follow the rules therein. If they did, for one thing, they'd know there is no seat saving, but we all know how poorly that rule is followed...

 

[o&smom]

While I understand the point that if no one has reported to medical then they can choose to say no symptoms aboard. But medical doesnt exist in a vacuum, staff and officers are mingling with the passengers and I am sure coughs were heard. And wouldnt it have been wonderful if they had been just a little proactive and had them mingling a little extra with the passengers to be on the lookout for symptomatic passengers.

@Dug720 It's not that I dont believe you but I just find it unbelievable that the waitstaff didnt report that family. Its not like there is open seating, they know who it was.

Since we all knew we were cruising during regular cold and flu season it seemed normal to hear a cough here and there; even though I think it was all in the back of our minds that it could be Corona virus. I commented to my husband that I was shocked how there was little to no coughing on our flights to New Orleans with it being cold and flu season. I have heard more coughing on a plane in the middle of the summer. Since my husband (who got his positive results back this morning) and I have shown no fever, no cough or trouble breathing I am sure people had NO idea they had Covid 19 since they did not have those symptoms either. We were all so programmed to be narrow sighted and worried about symptoms that seemed more severe and noticeable. I hope no one purposely hid any of these symptoms. I do know that at the end of the announcements made by the captain he implored people to report any symptoms to the health center.