Evening Magic Hours for Deluxe Guests Only

[Eastern]

If you don’t have hoppers, yes this will be an issue. Hopefully they announce the days / parks well in advance.

You can always add the hopper feature at GS in the parks.

 

[karen4546]

No, you can't. DVC points is still much more than a value room, almost twice as much.

Yes you can 10 pts STD studio @ $20/point and that is $200 a night NO TAX. You can also rent for less than $20/point. Look at the points charts and average rental per point. My value studio in October @ Jambo is 9 pts per night. Standard view is 13 pts.

 

[Nabas]

This and some other posts actually make me wonder about what it was like when the first values were created, etc/the first differences emerged. I don't know enough about that history!

Walt Disney envisioned Disneyland as a place for everyone to enjoy. Walt frequently spoke about providing his customers with "value", and DL was intended to be affordable (even if it was not cheap).

Still, Walt needed sponsors for the pavilions he was creating for the 1964 World's Fair, so he added a sponsor's lounge. The first hint of exclusiveness traces its origins to this 1964 World's Fair lounge.

Seeing the success of the World's Fair lounge, Walt wanted corporate sponsors for Disneyland to build more attractions. (Many of Walt's designs were expensive and reportedly Walt loved the idea of getting other corporations to pay for them.) Although Club 33 did not open until May 1967 (5 months after Walt's death), Walt envisioned Club 33 as a way to attract Disneyland corporate sponsors.

Club 33 aside, Disneyland and Walt Disney World remained firmly targeted for America's working and middle class for decades. For example, when WDW opened in 1971, theme park admission was $3.50 ($24 in today's dollars), while an "Adventure Book" ranged from $4.50 to $5.75 ($30 to $40). (Admission and attractions were combined into a single ticket in 1982.) Together, admission and attractions cost today's equivalent of about $64. I doubt few would consider a $64 ticket to be cheap, but a ticket in 1971 (relative to household income) was a lot less than what it is today.

Hotel prices were similar. A room at the Contemporary or the Polynesian (WDW's first two hotels) started at $29 per night, about $193 today. Again, WDW never was cheap, but it used to be more affordable.

IMO, WDW's value peaked in 1982-1984. The MK was complete, Epcot was new, and a 4-day hopper ticket (they were not called hoppers back then) cost $45 (tax included). That's about $120 in today's dollars for a 4-day hopper ticket. That's less than a one-day no-hopper ticket today. Before the days of computers, hotel rates were simple, with typically one rate year-round. In 1982, you could get a Garden View room at the Polynesian or a Garden Wing room at the Contemporary for $75 per night, about $209 per night in today's dollars.

Just imagine paying $120 for a 4-day ticket and $209 per night to stay at the Polynesian!

Beginning in 1984, things changed. Walt Disney Productions was the target of a hostile takeover and paid a great deal to buy back its own stock. The Board Of Directors recognized that the company was vulnerable and that a change in leadership was needed. For the first time, they brought in an outsider as CEO: Michael Eisner.

It was Michael Eisner who first started pushing prices and stratifying Guests when he took over in 1984. (Keep in mind that Club 33 originally was intended for corporate sponsors, not Guests.) 1984 to 1988 saw record (for Disney) price increases. These increases not only affected ticket prices, but hotel prices as well. Hotels such as the Contemporary, Poly, and Grand Floridan (opened in 1988) were no longer modestly priced. For example, a Garden View room at the Polynesian or a Garden Wing at the Contemporary was up to $160 per night ($364 per night adjusted for inflation) during "Value Season" (most of the year) and $175 per night ($398) during "Peak Season" (Spring Break and Christmas). Again, only 6 years before, it was an inflation adjusted $209 per night year-round.

To resolve the increasing gap between onsite and offsite hotels, Disney opened the Caribbean Beach Resort in 1988. Effectively, CBR was Disney's first "Value Resort". CBR opening year-round rates ranged from $65 per night ($148 in 2021 dollars) for a parking lot view to $85 per night ($193) for a pool or lake view.

However, after just a few more years of price increases under Eisner, CBR was no longer a value resort and the gap between onsite and offsite hotels had grown once again. The All Star Sports and All Star Music were opened in 1994 to close this gap. All Star rack rates ranged from $69 per night ($122 in 2021 dollars) to $79 per night ($140). For reference, 1994 rates at CBR were $89 ($162) to $121 ($220) per night, while the Poly ranged from $210 ($382) to $325 ($590) per night.

Since 1994, it's been a fairly steady stream of price hikes that generally have been about twice the rate of inflation, and about twice the annual increase of median household income. Still, Disney started offering hotel discounts (I think in the 1990s), which offset much of the rack rate price increases. For example, All Star Music was as low as $59 per night ($88) in 2002.

Hope this background helps!

 

[Sue M]

They are hoping that will happen. I see that once this pent up demand goes away that they will have issues filling rooms. I think once Epic Universe comes and Disney is still playing the money game they might be in trouble. Already people who only did Disney are now deciding on Universal.

What once was a place for everyone is now becoming a place for those who wish to spend big bucks. All the power to those that do. I have no issue with you. I just think they are traveling down a slippery slope.

Totally agree! We used to go only to WDW and were Passholders. With 2 trips a year from west coast 10-14 days each it was worth it. Then APs doubled in price, and no longer worth it, dropped the January trips And the AP. We stayed a lot at Deluxe resorts. Now priced out of them. IMO not worth the price.

WDW has slowly been raising prices and decreasing perks. Remember when they posted room rates and they stayed at that rate for the year? Now they raise them whenever.

We‘ve started doing more Universal now and have AP, with the occasional WDW trip. After this Aug WDW trip I don’t know when the next will be. For Oct Universal trip I grabbed a family suite room at Cabana Bay for arrival night because airline sched change for less than a tiny room at Pop. And certainly less than a Allstars Family suite! Then switching to a deluxe, Hard Rock for the price of a WDW moderate.
And being an out of state visitor, Universal allows you to pick the AP tier that works for you. Disney for some unknown reason makes non locals buy the highest priced AP. Blatant price grab.

I think this removing evening EMH for all but Deluxe resorts and decreasing morning EMH to 30 min, no DME, and no FPs may be the nail in the coffin for us. I don’t know how they can keep reducing benefits while raising prices. Not drinking the koolaide.

 

[Roxyfire]

Yes you can 10 pts STD studio @ $20/point and that is $200 a night NO TAX. You can also rent for less than $20/point. Look at the points charts and average rental per point. My value studio in October @ Jambo is 9 pts per night. Standard view is 13 pts.

Don't get me wrong, that's an amazing get as a renter. But this is not the norm. People often walk studio reservations in October, even more so for value studios. Again, great deal, this is probably not a situation that is very repeatable on a regular basis.

 

[Eastern]

There are plenty of people that would shell out 3 to 4 thousand a night if Disney would give them a reason to.

wow I feel poor after reading that; there is no way I would ever do that. You really think they could fill up a resort like that year round?

 

[ChipnDale79]

wow I feel poor after reading that; there is no way I would ever do that. You really think they could fill up a resort like that year round?

they will for the Star Wars resort.

I'm a huge Star Wars fan, in fact, i have my droid that i built last week sitting on my desk. But i know that i'll never be able to stay at the new Star Wars hotel. If i could afford it, id never pay it either.

 

[cakebaker]

What I find odd is they really don't have any deluxe properties on site. The Grand is 3/4* at best. I think Disney is missing the boat by not offering any 5* resort properties. There are plenty of people that would shell out 3 to 4 thousand a night if Disney would give them a reason to.

Three words.....Star Wars Hotel. That place will book up so fast your head will spin and while prices haven't been announced, rumors are it will cost in that price range for 2 people.

 

[StaceyHSD]

Star Wars hotel has like 100 rooms.

OTOH Disney has had problems filling the GF ever since it opened. Hence, the recent move to convert Big Pine (?) to DVC.

 

[jade1]

It's probably a sound business move now, but as discussed many times before ... what do you do during an economic downturn and you may have ticked off the old-school fans? They do have DVC to rely upon, but I think most times as soon as WDW starts offering discount packages or free dining everyone will come running back and the cycle begins anew

You answered your own scenario correctly IMO.

They have a lot of tech in place to make some very good offers "IF" need be.

1. Any onsite stay gets 5 reserved FP+.

2. Any onsite stay gets 3 Hours EMH at any park.

3. Select a Star Wars package including reserved RotR and MFalcon.

4. Early entry package.

5. Deluxe Dining for Deluxe Stays.

6. FP Package. Onsite includes 3 reserved FP+ AM in one park, and 3 FP+ Eve at another.

 

[DizneyFamof4]

We used to go to morning hours, then take our resort break at lunch and hopped to another park that evening. It was a break we were going to take regardless, so not a waste of travel time. EMH in the mornings were signficantly more crowded during the day, lesser crowds at non emh parks. But the EMH's got so crowded that we quit doing it. For evening hours, we just skipped that park entirely. They were more crowded during the day and the EMH's were too crowded to be useful.

I totally disagree about your take on the PM EMH. We had "always" went during night time EMH and by midnight a lot of the crowd had left and most of the rides were no more then 10 minute waits and when we left the park at 1 or 2 AM it was great because of the lack of crowds, the parks all lite up and no summer sun.

 

[ChipnDale79]

I totally disagree about your take on the PM EMH. We had "always" went during night time EMH and by midnight a lot of the crowd had left and most of the rides were no more then 10 minute waits and when we left the park at 1 or 2 AM it was great because of the lack of crowds, the parks all lite up and no summer sun.

This. you had the run of the parks that late at night, it was so much fun.

 

[cakebaker]

I totally disagree about your take on the PM EMH. We had "always" went during night time EMH and by midnight a lot of the crowd had left and most of the rides were no more then 10 minute waits and when we left the park at 1 or 2 AM it was great because of the lack of crowds, the parks all lite up and no summer sun.

It's been a long time since EMH's ran until 1 or 2am. But yes, back in the day, the super late nights were great. Still, those with children aren't near as likely to keep their kids out that late. I fondly recall our trip when the MK was open until 4am and we stayed until they ran us out, but those days are long gone.

 

[rlk]

The second trip (to a momdsp erate hotel) my parents generously paid for.

You are concerned that some people can't afford deluxe, but have you thought about all the people who can't afford a first or second trip to Disney because they don't have parents able to pay for their vacation.

 

[Sue M]

Me as well, I am wondering where the tipping point will be. I thought it was gonna be the boo bash but that sold like hot cakes, maybe it will be payed FP? idk but we keep showing disney they dont need to offer much and we will pay for anything they come up with. I am acually surprised its free for someone and not a payed for everyone..

I reached the tipping point a few years ago when they doubled price of AP, and started lowering discounts while raising room rates.

On the other hand, at Universal every hotel tier is better value than WDW. The Values are more like Disney’s moderates in terms of amenities. And the Universal moderate, Sapphire Falls is more like a WDW deluxe, but priced less than a WDW moderate.

 

[Wendysofftoneverland]

Boo Bash, good Lord above, that is a thing I was surprised went like it did. I fully expect the paid FP in some form. It won't be pretty!

We bought Boo Bash, but that is our only Disney park day of 7 nights on property...hoping it will be worth it for short lines. Rest of the trip, we will be hanging at Ft. Wilderness and heading over to Universal.

 

[dez1978]

No, you can't. DVC points is still much more than a value room, almost twice as much.

Just for fun, I looked at March 20-26 2022. Spring Break season. Pop for that week is 1567 for the cheapest room. AOA LM room is 1751. Or you could rent DVC thru Davids that SAME week at Old Key West, have a bigger room and this Deluxe perk, for 1786. So for $85 more, you could have a Deluxe resort for that week. I know it's not the same EVERY week all year. But it absolutely is doable for less than 1 single meal at Disney.

 

[ChipnDale79]

It's been a long time since EMH's ran until 1 or 2am. But yes, back in the day, the super late nights were great. Still, those with children aren't near as likely to keep their kids out that late. I fondly recall our trip when the MK was open until 4am and we stayed until they ran us out, but those days are long gone.

one of the reasons they're long gone, is because disney cut the park hours...and now for the rest of us, the magic hours.

Last week, MK closed at 9 all week long......

 

[Roxyfire]

We bought Boo Bash, but that is our only Disney park day of 7 nights on property...hoping it will be worth it for short lines. Rest of the trip, we will be hanging at Ft. Wilderness and heading over to Universal.

Hey hope you enjoy it! I did the Disney After Hours after bashing it and it was fun! But I don't know I'd do it again.

 

[dez1978]

Also point charts are deceiving. It's unlikely anyone will be able to rent some of the lowest category rooms and definitely not at short notice.


Oh yeah I love the discussion on it, I have no alliance to a corporation. There's many places to vacation, my family humors my love for disney world.

To be fair though, for the next couple of years you won't find to many of the cheap value rooms on short notice either. But you can almost always get a studio at SSR or OKW which runs about the same price as current POP and AOA rooms.